"Being black" is not probable cause

[dales]

At this point...I'm pretty sure we're screwed. I just hope that I keel over before the country does.

Speak for yourself.

Life is VERY GOOD for me, my children and grandchildren.

[rubato]

People are called for jury duty based on drivers license and state ID card data as well as voter registration.

And this will shock all of you but sometimes people lie and say things that aren't true to get out of serving on a jury.

That is why it is not evidence of voter fraud if someone "claims" they are not citizens.

And that is why there is almost no evidence of voter fraud at all.


Yrs,
Rubato

[rubato]

At this point...I'm pretty sure we're screwed. I just hope that I keel over before the country does.

Speak for yourself.

Life is VERY GOOD for me, my children and grandchildren.

In most respects we who are fortunate enough to live in the G-20 are better off now than ever before.

And with good fortune we will make enough progress on global warming to leave a decent future for the next generations.


Yrs,
Rubato

[oldr_n_wsr]

I learned the hard way that the only thing you say to a cop is "yes (or no) sir" and not to run from them nor struggle.

[Big RR]

Of course it's behavior like that ("the hard way") that earn police officers fear instead of respect.

[Jarlaxle]

I learned the hard way that the only thing you say to a cop is "yes (or no) sir" and not to run from them nor struggle.

"This interaction is being recorded and saved off-site in real time."

Answer to all questions should be, "Am I being detained or am I free to go?"

[Bicycle Bill]

I learned the hard way that the only thing you say to a cop is "yes (or no) sir" and not to run from them nor struggle.

"This interaction is being recorded and saved off-site in real time."

Answer to all questions should be, "Am I being detained or am I free to go?"

And the officer replies back, "Very well, since I am doing the same.  When this matter comes up in a court of law, we can then compare the recordings."  What's fair for the goose is fair for the gander.

As for being detained or free to go, what do you do when the cop says, "no, you are being detained for ________________ ". (suspicion of impaired driving, let's say).  Then what?  You going to expect the cop to deliver an entire analysis of the field sobriety test(s) he or she conducted on you and exactly what you did wrong so you can try to bullshit your way out of it?

-"BB"-

[Econoline]

I learned the hard way that the only thing you say to a cop is "yes (or no) sir" and not to run from them nor struggle.

The hard way? If it was really the hard way you wouldn't be alive to tell about it. (Just sayin'...)

[Jarlaxle]

I learned the hard way that the only thing you say to a cop is "yes (or no) sir" and not to run from them nor struggle.

"This interaction is being recorded and saved off-site in real time."

Answer to all questions should be, "Am I being detained or am I free to go?"

And the officer replies back, "Very well, since I am doing the same.  When this matter comes up in a court of law, we can then compare the recordings."  What's fair for the goose is fair for the gander.

I have been for mandatory body cameras for police officers for several years...which, of course, the police fight TOOTH AND NAIL.

As for being detained or free to go, what do you do when the cop says, "no, you are being detained for ________________ ". (suspicion of impaired driving, let's say).  Then what?  You going to expect the cop to deliver an entire analysis of the field sobriety test(s) he or she conducted on you and exactly what you did wrong so you can try to bullshit your way out of it?

-"BB"-

I haven't had a drink in almost 20 years...honestly, I might laugh in his face.

[liberty]

Hypothetical:

A specialized metal detector that is worn on the body under the clothes has been developed and issued to police officers without public notice.


A officer walks within range of a black male and the alarm sounds silently in the officer’s ear piece at a level indicating the mass of a hand gun. Would that be probable cause?

[Bicycle Bill]

Hypothetical:

A specialized metal detector that is worn on the body under the clothes has been developed and issued to police officers without public notice.


A officer walks within range of a black male and the alarm sounds silently in the officer’s ear piece at a level indicating the mass of a hand gun. Would that be probable cause?

Under current conditions, I would say no.  The black male may himself be a plains-clothes or off-duty police officer, or have a valid concealed-carry permit and a legitimate reason for doing so.

Possession of something does not always signify how it is going to be used.  Otherwise, anyone who is just standing around a street corner and has a vagina could possibly be considered to be a prostitute, and anyone with a penis a potential rapist.

-"BB"-

[liberty]

Hypothetical:

A specialized metal detector that is worn on the body under the clothes has been developed and issued to police officers without public notice.


A officer walks within range of a black male and the alarm sounds silently in the officer’s ear piece at a level indicating the mass of a hand gun. Would that be probable cause?

Under current conditions, I would say no.  The black male may himself be a plains-clothes or off-duty police officer, or have a valid concealed-carry permit and a legitimate reason for doing so.

Possession of something does not always signify how it is going to be used.  Otherwise, anyone who is just standing around a street corner and has a vagina could possibly be considered to be a prostitute, and anyone with a penis a potential rapist.

-"BB"-

That is true, but does the state have the right know the legal status of a hand gun on the street?

[Joe Guy]

Your first question has to do with whether the cop would have probable cause to search someone because his gun-o-meter started beeping. Knowing the legal status of someone's gun is a different question.

If the officer sees a gun, he responds one way. If the officer suspects the presence of a gun, he responds another way.

Either way, he ends up shooting the guy if he's black.

[liberty]

Your first question has to do with whether the cop would have probable cause to search someone because his gun-o-meter started beeping. Knowing the legal status of someone's gun is a different question.

If the officer sees a gun, he responds one way. If the officer suspects the presence of a gun, he responds another way.

Either way, he ends up shooting the guy if he's black.

The strength of the return signal to a metal detector receiver coil is dependent on the mass and density of the detected object. If the director is set to detect a typical hand gun that would be a couple pounds. Wouldn’t that be suspicious and warrant probable cause especially if a second handheld detectors located it at his shoulder or back waist band?

There are hand guns that weigh less than a pound, but they are typically smaller caliber or hold fewer rounds such as derringer.

[liberty]

At this point...I'm pretty sure we're screwed. I just hope that I keel over before the country does.

Speak for yourself.

Life is VERY GOOD for me, my children and grandchildren.

The drug business is good, is it. Depressed people are good customers

[Joe Guy]

The strength of the return signal to a metal detector receiver coil is dependent on the mass and density of the detected object. If the director is set to detect a typical hand gun that would be a couple pounds. Wouldn’t that be suspicious and warrant probable cause especially if a second handheld detectors located it at his shoulder or back waist band.....

If your hypothetical handgun detector became a legal tool for police to use, it could warrant probable cause if the guy is in a jurisdiction that doesn't allow a person to carry a concealed weapon. If the jurisdiction allowed concealed weapons, the detected gun wouldn't be enough for probable cause in and of itself.

That's how the law would work in my hypothetical jurisdiction.

[Scooter]

The strength of the return signal to a metal detector receiver coil is dependent on the mass and density of the detected object. If the director is set to detect a typical hand gun that would be a couple pounds. Wouldn’t that be suspicious and warrant probable cause especially if a second handheld detectors located it at his shoulder or back waist band.

Because all cops carry around handheld metal detectors as standard issue.

And you wonder why folks believe you are the result of multigenerational sibling incest.

[Burning Petard]

White aussie blonds in PJs, not so much.

Woman calls 911 to report a 'disturbance' in the ally where she lives. The two cops in one car arrive and the woman is standing outside in the alley, in Pajamas. She begins talking to the driver.

" Three sources with knowledge of the incident said Sunday that two officers in one squad car, responding to the 911 call, pulled into the alley. Damond, in her pajamas, went to the driver’s side door and was talking to the driver. The officer in the passenger seat pulled his gun and shot Damond through the driver’s side door, sources said. No weapon was found at the scene."

After a shooting of a black man with a CCW permit in his car while a woman and child were in the car recording and transmitting it live, the entire street police in that city were equipped with body cameras. In the incident above, the body cameras were turned off.

http://www.startribune.com/woman-killed ... 4782213/#1

Another FUBAR for the police.

[BoSoxGal]

I read about this, it's beyond comprehension. It will be sickening to see what kind of story the po-po fabricate about this murder.

Apparently this very nice lady was about to be married to an American, and had lived here for a few years. She was very well liked and apparently was known to have commented to friends and family many times how much nicer it was in Australia where the people aren't all carrying guns.

I wonder how many civilians the cops in Australia kill every year?

[Bicycle Bill]

After a shooting of a black man with a CCW permit in his car while a woman and child were in the car recording and transmitting it live, the entire street police in that city were equipped with body cameras. In the incident above, the body cameras were turned off.

http://www.startribune.com/woman-killed ... 4782213/#1

Another FUBAR for the police.

Both officers should already be 'former officers', as they should have been immediately summoned to the office of the commissioner (or whoever is in charge of the cops in Mipple City) and discharged for willful violation of the directive to have their body cams — or the vehicle's dashcam — turned on.

Here's an excerpt from the directive. The caller reported a suspicious person, so as I read it, the interaction with this caller fits at least three of the scenarios (which I've highlighted for emphasis):

When safe to do so, Minneapolis officers should activate their bodycams during the following situations.  Activation shall occur as soon as possible, but before any citizen contact.
● Traffic stops.
● Suspicious Person stops.
● Suspicious Vehicle stops.
● Any vehicular response requiring emergency driving as defined by MPD P/P 7402, or emergency response as defined by MPD P/P 7403.
● Vehicle pursuits.
● Work-related transports not involving a ridealong or another City employee in their official capacity as a City employee.
● Any search, including but not limited to searches of vehicles, persons, and buildings.
● Any contact involving criminal activity.
● Any contact involving physical or verbal confrontations.
● Any contact that is, or becomes adversarial.
● When advising a person of their Miranda rights.
● When ordered to by a supervisor.
● Prior to any use of force. (If a bodycam is not activated prior to a use of force, it shall be activated as soon as it is safe to do so.)
● Any tactical entry or forced entry into a building, unless a supervisor has determined in advance that the video or audio data could result in the disclosure of operational or tactical information that would compromise the effectiveness of future actions or jeopardize officer safety.

If a situation changes to require activation, the officer shall immediately activate the BWC as soon as it is safe to do so.

Should she have stayed indoors and let the police handle it instead of coming outside and putting herself in harm's way, whether at the hands of the suspicious person or, as it turned out, at the hands of the police?  20/20 hindsight says the answer is yes; but since when did police policy for the use of force become "Shoot first, shoot later, shoot some more and then when everybody's dead try to ask a question or two" ?

-"BB"-