Goodbye overtime rules.

[Crackpot]

You assume people will learn

[wesw]

actually, guin, I might need your advice sometime....

...you gave me good advice about my daughter once. it was helpful and I appreciated it.

thanks,

wes

[Gob]

A book I heartily recommend;

[Bicycle Bill]

Contempt. I got a PI 2 weeks ago ....

PI, in this instance, means what?  Personal Injury or Public Intoxication?

-"BB"-

[Guinevere]

Contempt. I got a PI 2 weeks ago ....

PI, in this instance, means what?  Personal Injury or Public Intoxication?

-"BB"-

Preliminary Injunction

[Scooter]

actually, guin, I might need your advice sometime....

After all the venom you have spewed out at her, you have balls of purest brass to be asking her for any kind of a favour.

[Bicycle Bill]

actually, guin, I might need your advice sometime....

After all the venom you have spewed out at her, you have balls of purest brass to be asking her for any kind of a favour.

I can't see Guin granting any favors either.  If anything, she gets out her "rates for assholes" billing schedule and socks it to him.

-"BB"-

[Burning Petard]

Gob, I have read that book. I even own a copy.

As long as we are in the book recommending mode, for you I suggest "Look Me In The Eye" by John Elder Robinson.

snailgate

[ex-khobar Andy]

Federal judge in east TX has just decided that the new OT rule is unlawful. Too much burden on small business. So now several million low and mid pay workers who were slated to get OT under the new rule, which was essentially reverting the maths of who gets OT back to how it was 40 years ago, now will not.

Unfortunately I think that the majority of people who are affected by this will have voted for the same animals who welcome this ruling. http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-e ... SKBN13H2JY

I think it's a disaster. I will not be affected personally since I am over the limit. But about 20 of my colleagues will be. I don't yet know how my company will handle this since it happened only in the last couple of hours.

[Guinevere]

I just saw that. But how does a Texas District Court have authority over the entire nation. It's still just the opinion of one lower court judge. Was there injunctive relief involved? The article only says "a motion." For what relief?

And I think the judge's analysis is just plain wrong -- apparently he has never had to actually apply the FLSA regulations. The test for an exempt executive employee involves salary basis, plus a job duties analysis, plus management of 2 or more employees, plus the executive employee must be involved in the hiring/firing/change in status of the employees, or input from the executive employee must be given "significant weight." It is a fact intensive analysis, and varies considerably from company to company and executive employee to executive employee. Even raising the salary threshold does not make it a de facto salary basis test. Plus, the numbers are 40 years out of date. If the new salary was measured in lrelative 1975 dollars, and was valid in 1975, how can it not. E valid today?

Ugh.

[Sue U]

actually, guin, I might need your advice sometime....

After all the venom you have spewed out at her, you have balls of purest brass to be asking her for any kind of a favour.

I can't see Guin granting any favors either.  If anything, she gets out her "rates for assholes" billing schedule and socks it to him.

-"BB"-

You're selling Guin short. One thing I can tell you is that she is a true professional and a class act. Vindictiveness is not in her nature. Passion, but not pettiness.

[Scooter]

All the more reason why our resident brownshirt is a despicable sleaze for presuming to ask her for help.

[liberty]

[I can't see Guin granting any favors either.  If anything, she gets out her "rates for assholes" billing schedule and socks it to him.

-"BB"-

You're selling Guin short. One thing I can tell you is that she is a true professional and a class act. Vindictiveness is not in her nature. Passion, but not pettiness.

I have to admit she is generally a nice person.

[Long Run]

https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/fi ... &utm_term=

It is a nationwide injunction. The rule only applies to "white collar" workers, not blue collar hourly workers. The judge was appointed by Obama. 21 states plus private interests challenged the rule. Don't know how this will come out eventually or if Congress should take action, but it is clear this is a real issue.

[ex-khobar Andy]

Going by memory here so forgive me if I get a date or two wrong. This thing first appeared in the Federal Register six months ago for comment. And now, a few days before it is due to come into effect they get a ruling. Our company, for example, has decided to come into compliance a few days early to coincide with a pay period, so for us the date is Nov 26. And of course there is a little holiday between now and then. All responsible companies, and I am guessing all of Trump's 516 companies or whatever the number is, have already spent the $$$$$ to get their tracking and payroll systems into readiness. And we have promised all these folk an effective raise because we will finally pay them for OT. Really not a huge deal financially, because although it will raise our costs a bit it will have the same effect on our competitors. Same applies if you run a bar or a pizza place. And it may eventually lower our costs because we may have a more contented workforce.

Idiotic.

[Guinevere]

That is a bad decision, full of errors. I have litigated the issue of exempt executive and administrative employees several times, and I have won - which is not easy to do in this arena. My labor experience is on the management side and I think this is a bad decision, and that most employers knew the salary figures needed to be updated.

In any event, it may be a moot point, of the case will be reviewed. I hope the case is reviewed, I would hate to see bad law like this stand.

Ex-KA, the Final rule was issued just before memorial day, The proposal came out at least a year before that.

[kmccune]

let them eat cake ,I used to work for a low wage company ( better part of 30 years ) now the secretary and her helper used to be ,the wife and daughter( one reason there are rules against nepotism I suppose ) and they were good about dodging workmans comp claims ,most of the time if you got injured on the job ,they made sure the health insurance took care of it.The only time I needed workmans comp ,in a big way was when I needed to recuperate from surgery to repair a broken vertabra .Now just so happens that an insurance policy that the company offered was paying for the lost wages after the prerequsite hoops
(did I mention the employees paid for that out of their wages as a salary reduction ?) anyway to make a long story short ,I didnt get a penny of workmans comp ,but almoat recieved to the dollar what I paid into this penerious accident plan.( Did I mention this companies owners were staunch repubs and the daughter a teabagger ?
I will give them credit for this back when Blue cross was cheap they did pay it (back around 79 the Main boss figured it was worth about 52 cents an hour and kept people like myself under the magic $5 an hour level but they did do one thing which made a little difference,they would pay OT for any hours over 8 up to 40 hrs(after which it didnt make any ) difference anyway.Even when I was a foreman I never got to take a company vehicle home ,we usually left the shop before 6 am and oft times didnt get back till after 7 pm.When I finally left them in 04 they were making us pay part of our Health insurance,the year after I got of prison the President of the company rehired me and didnt even offer me health insurance (He fired me in February the next year ,which held up mu UI benefits for a couple of months.
All in all ,I think they have done pretty good for themselves ,acquiring hundreds of acres of land ,taking extensive hunting trips and having practically every toy they could want ( meanwhile back at the ranch -one of the bosses wondered why I always bought the cheapest vehicle I could( answer because that was all I could afford ) tell you what ,I am happy to no longer be in their employ .

[Burning Petard]

Just how does a federal court judge in Texas hold up new rules outside his district, for the entire nation? At least that is what the general news media seems to be reporting.

snailgate

[ex-khobar Andy]

Per Guin, right about this stuff as usual:

EKA, the Final rule was issued just before memorial day, The proposal came out at least a year before that.

Yes, the initial Notice of Proposed Rulemaking was in May 2015 or thereabouts, and the final rule in May of this year. I used to read the FR daily to keep up with new regs EPA was issuing because that was what our clients paid us to do, so I have a little comprehension of the process. There were 5775 public comments on the NPRM. You can read them all on line if you like that sort of thing. The old line about sausages and lawmaking is very apt in this case.

I have looked at about fifty random comments. Obviously there was a concerted effort from the construction industry to oppose the rule because maybe half of them were identical cut and paste jobs. There were comments from employers who obviously had not read the rule who thought they were going to have to double salaries. And thankfully there were comments from ordinary workers who were basically saying - at long last those pricks are going to have to pay me for what I do. But bottom line - employers have known the basic shape of the rule for 18 months and the final rule for six months; and responsible employers (I.e., most of them) have just got on with it and put procedures in place to implement it.

I don't yet know what my employer will do. We could probably go ahead with the plans already in place and comply. Maybe it will raise our labor costs by 5% or so. But if we raise our costs in a world where the competition decides not to, we will lose work to the other guy. It's going to be interesting.

[wesw]

anyway.....

the advice guin gave me was personal advice.

it was helpful, it was appreciated.

it is still helpful.

it is still appreciated.

wes

(scooter, a fox smells its own hole)

(it seems to me that YOU condemn and hate whole classes of people)

(and you cross national boundaries, electronically, to do it)

(for you to call someone venomous or hateful is hypocrisy of the highest, and lowest, level)

(just post your little memes, grown folks are talking....)

(you seem evil to me, as your avatar suggests)

(bye, Felicia.)