From Russia With Love

[Guinevere]

Interesting piece. I don't have time to check all the sources, but this is consistent with some of the other bits and pieces I've seen flying around social media. Is it good investigative journalism, pure speculation, wishful thinking, or outright fantasy? Decide for yourself. Only time and a thorough investigation will tell.

This allegation is by far the most extraordinary one ever leveled against a U.S. President. Nixon was accused of covering up a burglary; Reagan, of running illegal arms deals to funnel covert money to insurgents. Never before has there been the suggestion that a sitting president has actually been suborned by a foreign power, much less that this foreign power actively worked to install him in office.

The information the public has so far is very damning against some Trump aides (such as Flynn), potentially very damning against others (such as Manafort), and is “circumstantial but intriguing” with respect to the core allegation. What needs to happen next is an open and public investigation of these matters: specifically, of the conduct of Michael Flynn, Jared Kushner, Paul Manafort, Jeff Sessions, Donald Trump, and their other allies and associates with respect to illegal payments from the Russian government.

[Lord Jim]

From Russia With Love

Sure, give me an excuse to post this...

Hit it Matt:




(A lot of people think it was Andy Williams who did the vocal, but it was actually the far lesser known crooner Matt Monroe...)

[liberty]

Is it against the law to talk to the Russians?

Remember when Bill Clinton’s campaign took money from the Chinese; was that ever investigated? Don’t foreigners donate money to American politicians, isn’t that interfering in American elections. Are you guys hypocrites?

[Joe Guy]

Were the Chinese government and Bill Clinton's Administration being investigated for attempts to tamper with our election and cause George HW Bush to lose the election?

I must have missed that...

[Econoline]

Is it against the law to talk to the Russians?

It depends on what you're talking to them about. Some things are legal, some aren't. But if you lie about it later, under oath, that's definitely illegal.

Remember when Bill Clinton’s campaign took money from the Chinese; was that ever investigated?

Not quite sure exactly what you're referring to here. I think I recall some allegations of a couple of Taiwanese businessmen trying donate to the Democratic Party, and the money being returned. If you could supply a link to a reputable (i.e., not a rightwing conspiracy site) news source, that might help.

Don’t foreigners donate money to American politicians, isn’t that interfering in American elections.

No, they don't...and yes, that is interfering in American elections--which is why it's illegal for anyone who is not either a U.S. citizen or a U.S. permanent resident (green-card holder) to donate to an American political candidate, political campaign, or political party.

Are you guys hypocrites?

Quite likely; isn't everyone at least a little bit hypocritical about something?

[Lord Jim]

Is it against the law to talk to the Russians?

It's not against the law to talk to a Mafia Don or a hit man either...

It all depends on what you talk about...

[Burning Petard]

And it is a crime to lie to a federal agent even if you are not under oath. That is why it is very risky to 'cooperate' with the FBI. They rarely record interviews and it is up to you to some how prove the FBI is mis-quoting you.

snailgate

[liberty]

Were the Chinese government and Bill Clinton's Administration being investigated for attempts to tamper with our election and cause George HW Bush to lose the election?

I must have missed that...

Does it matter? Any interference form the outside should be unacceptable. May be there is good interference and bad interference: Remember when people in Britain where writing letters to people in red states trying to persuade them not to vote for GW. I don’t remember you guys having any problem with that. And what about when foreigners participate in American political demonstrations. Do you have any problem with that; if you don’t you are hypocrite.

[liberty]

quote]Quite likely; isn't everyone at least a little bit hypocritical about something?

Hypocrisy is dishonorable only fit for scum; I a not perfect, but I try hard to avoid being a hypocrite myself.

[Crackpot]

Except every time you claim you're not racist.

[Lord Jim]

Remember when people in Britain where writing letters to people in red states trying to persuade them not to vote for GW.

I have no problem seeing the huge difference between individual private citizens of foreign countries expressing their personal opinions of the candidates in a US Presidential campaign, (whether you agree with those opinions or not) and a coordinated effort by a hostile regime utilizing the full power of the state to engage in wholesale election interference by hacking thousands of emails from one party's national committee and one candidates senior campaign staff, and then selectively releasing these stolen emails over the course of the campaign in an effort to affect the result.

Here's somebody else who has no problem seeing that difference:

Dick Cheney: Russian Election Interference Possibly ‘Act of War’

Former Vice President Dick Cheney says Russia's alleged interference in the U.S. presidential election could be interpreted by some as an "act of war."

"There was a very serious effort made by Mr. Putin and his government, his organization, to interfere in major ways with our basic, fundamental democratic processes," Cheney said, referring to Russian President Vladimir Putin. "In some quarters that would be considered an act of war."

"I would not underestimate the weight that we, as Americans, assign to the Russian attempts to interfere with our internal political processes," Cheney said.

Cheney's statement comes at a time when both the U.S. Senate and House of Representatives intelligence committees are investigating alleged Russian meddlin in the election that brought President Donald Trump to power.

U.S. intelligence agencies have concluded that Russia conducted a covert hacking operation to undermine the U.S. election process, which evolved into an attempt to help Trump win the White House. They also believe with "a high level of confidence" that Putin became personally involved in the campaign to interfere in the election.

Cheney's comments came up in the context of him speaking about the changing nature of the U.S. -Russia relationship being a threat to U.S. security and globalization.

In his speech to the Economic Times Global Business Summit in the Indian city of New Delhi on Monday, Cheney listed off some of Putin's recent actions as examples of how he believes Russia is flexing its muscles as a global power.

George W. Bush's vice president said he believes Putin "has designs on the Baltics … We know he wanted Crimea, he took it. Has aspirations in respect to Ukraine and is doing everything he can to find ways to undermine NATO."

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-h ... ar-n739391

[Burning Petard]

I hear on the radio that President Trump is gonna kill the Obama proposals for personal data privacy and internet service providers.

Those commercial business will be allowed to sell all your personal data about internet use--announced purpose is to let advertisers more efficiently target their ads. But a sale is a sale. Some anti-trumpers with deep pockets should buy all the data on the entire Trump family and then make it public.

snailgate.

[Guinevere]

Remember when people in Britain where writing letters to people in red states trying to persuade them not to vote for GW.

I have no problem seeing the huge difference between individual private citizens of foreign countries expressing their personal opinions of the candidates in a US Presidential campaign, (whether you agree with those opinions or not) and a coordinated effort by a hostile regime utilizing the full power of the state to engage in wholesale election interference by hacking thousands of emails from one party's national committee and one candidates senior campaign staff, and then selectively releasing these stolen emails over the course of the campaign in an effort to affect the result.

Here's somebody else who has no problem seeing that difference:

Dick Cheney: Russian Election Interference Possibly ‘Act of War’

Former Vice President Dick Cheney says Russia's alleged interference in the U.S. presidential election could be interpreted by some as an "act of war."

"There was a very serious effort made by Mr. Putin and his government, his organization, to interfere in major ways with our basic, fundamental democratic processes," Cheney said, referring to Russian President Vladimir Putin. "In some quarters that would be considered an act of war."

"I would not underestimate the weight that we, as Americans, assign to the Russian attempts to interfere with our internal political processes," Cheney said.

Cheney's statement comes at a time when both the U.S. Senate and House of Representatives intelligence committees are investigating alleged Russian meddlin in the election that brought President Donald Trump to power.

U.S. intelligence agencies have concluded that Russia conducted a covert hacking operation to undermine the U.S. election process, which evolved into an attempt to help Trump win the White House. They also believe with "a high level of confidence" that Putin became personally involved in the campaign to interfere in the election.

Cheney's comments came up in the context of him speaking about the changing nature of the U.S. -Russia relationship being a threat to U.S. security and globalization.

In his speech to the Economic Times Global Business Summit in the Indian city of New Delhi on Monday, Cheney listed off some of Putin's recent actions as examples of how he believes Russia is flexing its muscles as a global power.

George W. Bush's vice president said he believes Putin "has designs on the Baltics … We know he wanted Crimea, he took it. Has aspirations in respect to Ukraine and is doing everything he can to find ways to undermine NATO."

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-h ... ar-n739391

Congresswoman Jackie Spier (I believe *your* Congresswoman, LJ), raised this very issue in the House Intelligence Committee hearing with Comey and Rogers. She was asking them if they believed such an action could constitute an act of war.

Like a good lawyer, she was developing the facts she will want to use later. If this is an act of war, and if it can be shown that the Trumpanzee colluded/collaborated/assisted, then you have the basic elements of treason. Which is one of the enumerated grounds for impeachment.

So yes, good on you, DickieC, but it wasn't your original thought.

[Sue U]

In his speech to the Economic Times Global Business Summit in the Indian city of New Delhi on Monday,

Cheney was in India? A missed opportunity to arrest him and try him for war crimes. But then again, it's unlikely that Modi's government sees anything wrong with torturing Muslims.

[Crackpot]

He went there because after watching Temple of Doom he wanted to compare notes on how to live without a heart.

[Big RR]

So yes, good on you, DickieC, but it wasn't your original thought.

and just because Cheney said/endorsed it, doesn't mean it's wrong.

[Guinevere]

July 27, 2016, Trump: "Russia, if you're listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing."
Indictment: That evening, Russian operatives targeted Clinton campaign emails "for the first time."

Rod J. Rosenstein, the deputy attorney general, on Friday announced new charges against 12 Russian intelligence officers accused of hacking the Democratic National Committee, the Clinton presidential campaign and the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee. The announcement came just a few days before President Trump is expected to meet with President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia in Helsinki, Finland.

The 11-count indictment includes charges of conspiracy by the Russian intelligence officials against the United States, money laundering and attempts to break into state boards of elections and other government agencies.

The indictment is part of the special counsel’s investigation into Russia’s interference in the 2016 presidential campaign.

Article here: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/13/us/p ... cking.html

Indictment here: https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthelper ... d/full.pdf

[RayThom]

More WITCHES hunted down.

Who knew?

[Lord Jim]

More WITCHES hunted down.

Yeah, 12 at one go...

If they had managed to get one more, they could have nailed a whole coven in one fell swoop...

[Bicycle Bill]

More WITCHES hunted down.

Yeah, 12 at one go...

If they had managed to get one more, they could have nailed a whole coven in one fell swoop...

I thought you only needed three for a coven ... the Maiden, the Mother, and the Crone.  Although according to the writings of the late and lamented Sir Pterry Pratchett,

• "Your average witch is not, by nature, a social animal as far as other witches are concerned.  There's a conflict of dominant personalities.  There's a group of ringleaders without a ring.  There's a basic unwritten rule of witchcraft which is 'Don't do what you will, do what I say'.  The natural size of a coven is one.  Witches only get together when they can't avoid it."

-"BB"-