Do you want a solution to gun ownership?

Burning Petard · Post by **Burning Petard** » Tue Jun 20, 2017 8:11 pm

Older, you may not have a choice about whether or not you are a member of the militia. From wikipedia:

"Today, as defined by the Militia Act of 1903, the term "militia" is primarily used to describe two groups within the United States:

Organized militia – consisting of State militia forces; notably, the National Guard and Naval Militia.[9] (Note: the National Guard is not to be confused with the National Guard of the United States.)
Unorganized militia – composing the Reserve Militia: every able-bodied man of at least 17 and under 45 years of age, not a member of the National Guard or Naval Militia."

So I am guessing that you and I have aged out of the Unorganized militia. I suppose we need a test case to go to the SCOTUS claiming that this law is unconstitutional by including only able-bodied males under 45 years of age.

snailgate

Scooter · Post by **Scooter** » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:16 pm

Where was the NRA when Philando Castile was slaughtered by a trigger happy thug in uniform (who unsurprisingly has gotten off scot free) for no reason other than he was in lawful possession of a firearm? Apparently they believe that every American has the right to bear arms unless he or she is black.

Burning Petard · Post by **Burning Petard** » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:37 pm

Oh Scooter, you have not taken in to account the magic words in police shootings. Police in America are individual citizens who have sworn an oath (I have no idea what that oath is, but I hear frequently about 'sworn police officers') and are thus authorized to kill other individuals in particular circumstances. One of those circumstances is to stand up in court and testify that at the particular time they were "in fear for their life."

That was the case of the officer who killed an unarmed man near Tulsa Oklahoma while supported by several other officers who did not shoot because they were not that scared. The officer in your cited case said the magic words in court and so he was set free. In my own mind, that was really the case. I think he was so scared that the executive function of his own mind had shut down and was reacting at the very primitive level of Gun Present==I must shoot.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/dashcam-vide ... 47044.html

snailgate

ex-khobar Andy · Post by **ex-khobar Andy** » Thu Jun 22, 2017 2:50 am

Yes NRA have been very slow to put together any kind of response to the Castile killing. The man was legally carrying; was permitted to do so; told the cop that he was armed; and did everything right except had a tail light out.

NRA is usually quick to defend those legally armed against murderous thugs.

Jarlaxle · Post by **Jarlaxle** » Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:19 pm

They did make at least one statement...the media, of course, gave it a good leaving-alone.

Scooter · Post by **Scooter** » Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:36 am

This is what they had to say, a whole lot of nothing. And once the investigation was completed (their excuse for not commenting further), what did they say? Nothing. And once the verdict came down, what did they say? Nothing.

You go ahead and try to convince me that this would have been SOP if the guy had been white.

liberty · Post by **liberty** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:12 am

Bicycle Bill wrote:
The civilian militia being anyone ( civilian ) willing to defend the country in time of emergency provided the individual has no criminal record and is a mentally competent adult citizen of the US with no serious mental or personality defects.
Even the Second Amendment refers to a "well-regulated militia". What you describe is not a militia or even an Old West-style posse; it's little more than an armed rabble — a slightly more lethal version of the mob that stormed the Bastille in 1789.

And as for your request to 'Please vote only, no commentary' —

-"BB"-

Sorry that it took me so long to respond, but I have a lot going on and I found another forum that distracted me for a while. It is an ideal site for me; I can start a discussion there on history, anthropology or geography and don’t even have to use race as a hook to get poster interested. The place is filled with nerds like me, but on the negative side they are mostly young adults so there are a lot of comments about weird music I have never heard of which makes me feel kind of old. However, on the positive side there are a lot of foreigners perhaps close to half with a lot of them from the Middle East and North Africa, MENA we say.

Well at any rate, back to the primary reason it has been so long. I got tired of starting posts and letting them die on me. As I am sure you know I work on standby. I spend a lot of my time waiting for a service call. When I am paged, I have to respond immediately. I would start a comment and then I would get a text alerting me to a call; I would drop everything and get on the road. By the time I would get back to it the next day or so I had lost interest. It is hard for me to write when I have lost that motivation. A few times I have tried to rush and finish a reply and really screwed it up. So I vowed to myself that I would not post again on this forum until I replied to this one. So here goes:

I respect your response because if I felt someone was trying to tell me I couldn’t do something I had a right to do I would probably respond in a similar fashion. If someone tells me I have to do or can’t do something or even implies it they are most likely are going to get the response opposite to the one they want. But I wasn’t telling you what to do but seeking your cooperation.

I deal even worse with threats:
When I was in school I took a welding course. I wanted to be a certified welder (You guys don’t have a clue what that means, but that is not important). Unfortunately I didn’t have the talent to certify, but as usual I was fanatically determined to do it. (You all might not have noticed that I can be a little obsessive.) Well we had this guy in the class that liked to go into the booths and fondle the guys privates while they were welding. We didn’t think much about it; no one had complained to the instructor and he seemed to take rejection well.
We figured he was just a queer looking for a partner. Queer was the word used in those days. No one really cared about homosexuality. One day I was intently practicing overhead welding, a very difficult position when I felt him grab my balls. I was intent on what I was doing and didn’t even look up; I knew who it was. I said get the hell out of here and pushed him out of my booth and went back to welding without taking my eyes off what I was doing. The next thing I knew my helmet flew off my head. He was punching me, so I hit him in the head with my fist he didn’t like that. It was ok for him to hit me, but If I landed a blow that was an outrage. He must have been a liberal fascist. At that point he decided to use his weight advantage and grabbed me and placed me in a headlock. And then he said those most dangerous words,” If you don’t stop this I will kill you”. I believed what he said. I broke loose of the headlock and grabbed a chipping hammer and hit him twice above the ear. That took the desire to fight out of him. I hit him with the side of the hammer; if I had hit him with the pointed end It could have killed him. I respect other people's rights and demand the same from others. Rights are important they are worth dying and killing over.

I was not telling you what to do I was making a request. I wanted to get some unbiased votes before group think took control. I really believe there is a compromise that will solve the problem of the misuse of guns.

Joe Guy · Post by **Joe Guy** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:43 am

So it's okay for you to write a commentary but if we do, it's an outrage....

RayThom · Post by **RayThom** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 11:46 am

liberty wrote:... When I was in school I took a welding course. I wanted to be a certified welder (You guys don’t have a clue what that means, but that is not important)...

Wha...what? I beg your pardon but I know exactly what a certified welder is. He's the guy who has a specialized patch emblazoned on all his Lincoln K4416 Standard Welding Gear. So there!

Lord Jim · Post by **Lord Jim** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:02 pm

Though I frequently disagree with your take on things lib, it's nice to see you posting again...(seems we've had a lot of posters fade on us recently...especially most of our non-American contingent)

But here's the question I'd really like to ask you..

Are you ready to burn your MAGA hat?

liberty · Post by **liberty** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:24 am

Lord Jim wrote: But here's the question I'd really like to ask you..

Are you ready to burn your MAGA hat?

I don’t wear other people’s hats, well did wear the Air Force hat, but I considered it my Air Force. And as far as making America great again I would be all for it I didn’t consider it a lost cause. America is in decline and obviously there is nothing that change that. The Nobel Prize winning god Obama was supposed to be the man, but he did nothing but make the situation worse. The only thing to do now is to teacher your grandchildren Russian.

RayThom · Post by **RayThom** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:54 am

AMERICA... Love It Or Leave It!

dales · Post by **dales** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:08 am

liberty wrote:The only thing to do now is to teacher your grandchildren Russian.

Joe Guy · Post by **Joe Guy** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:17 am

Lord Jim wrote:...(seems we've had a lot of posters fade on us recently...especially most of our non-American contingent)....

We need to get more people involved to wake this place up. I've been just lurking and not posting much, and according to rubato, wesw has taken a recess in my mind...

rubato wrote:....Now that Wes appears to have slipped back into the recesses of JGs imagination there is no one here whose reaction to this would be different.....

liberty · Post by **liberty** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:25 am

dales wrote:
liberty wrote:The only thing to do now is to teacher your grandchildren Russian.

I don’t do videos so I must ask:
Well, how many divisions do they have?

RayThom · Post by **RayThom** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:52 am

"Trumped up" malaise has taken its toll. Maybe a dose of POTU2 will pull them back in.

Any day now, any day...

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:56 am

Bicycle Bill · Post by **Bicycle Bill** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:45 am

BoSoxGal wrote:

The fact there is a 'politifake.org' watermark on that meme sort of undermines the message, so I did a little research. According to this pro-gun website it is apparently true, although they appear to be doing their best to throw him under the bus as being totally incorrect with regard to the tenets of the Second Amendment ... at least as they feel it should be interpreted.

I also found it interesting that the hearing at which his testimony was given had to do with the National Firearms Act of 1934, which was a virtual ban on machine guns, short-barreled shotguns, short-barreled rifles, and sound suppressors (silencers) — with exceptions for law enforcement officers, which the author of the 'keepandbeararms.com' article equates to a hypothetical ban on Bibles.

-"BB"-

Burning Petard · Post by **Burning Petard** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 1:20 pm

The NRA has an interesting history. It was started after the American civil war in an effort to improve civilian marksmanship. Many 'experts found that most infantryman were lousy shots. So the idea was to use government surplus firearms and encourage civilians to shoot target competitions with them. It was completely in line with the view that the second amendment is about equipment for militia.

Later military scholarship has only continued to wring their hands at the inefficiency of the average rifleman in combat. This was a major force in the adoption of the full auto M16 in Viet Nam and the 'spray and pray' philosophy for the grunt on the ground. Actual marksmanship has been shifted to sniper units.

Now the National Rifle Association magazine is mostly about how to prepare the homeland to defeat the boogieman under the bed. No more lengthy descriptions of the ammo and guns used at Camp Perry for the Wimbledon Cup. Or details of the modifications to the basic holding technic used in winning the three position .22 rimfire competition.

BoSoxGal · Post by **BoSoxGal** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:04 pm

It's in the Congressional record:

Frederick served as president of the National Rifle Association and vice president of the US Revolver Association. He was a strong supporter of gun control, and during hearings on the National Firearms Act in 1934 testified "I have never believed in the general practice of carrying weapons. I seldom carry one. ... I do not believe in the general promiscuous toting of guns. I think it should be sharply restricted and only under licenses."[2]

A few other references to the testimony:

https://newrepublic.com/article/111266/ ... un-control

http://www.npr.org/2016/06/30/484215890 ... st-gun-law

You can request the text from the Library of Congress if you don't believe me or the journalists who have researched it.

Even the gun nuts acknowledge it, and this page includes the Congressional testimony, so that'll save you a call to the Library of Congress:

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/nra/nfa.asp

eta: I see you posted the same link as just above, but I'll leave mine just the same. I *do*, in fact, research stuff before I post it.

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