ETA: I always crush my cig. butts in my hand and toss them in the nearest trash can.Brown vetoes smoking ban at state beaches and parks
By J.K. Dineen Published 5:36 pm, Friday, October 6, 2017
Smokers will continue to be able to light up at state beaches and parks after Gov. Jerry Brown vetoed a bill Friday that would have banned smoking in both those places.
In his veto message, Brown suggested that the ban — which would have applied to cigarettes, cigars, marijuana and e-cigarettes — was overkill.
“If people can’t even smoke on a deserted beach, where can they?” Brown wrote. “There must be some limits to the coercive power of government.”
Brown also objected to the $485 penalty that violators would have been slapped with, calling it “excessive.”
The governor noted that he vetoed a similar bill last year. He called that one a “far-reaching prohibition in every state park and every state beach (that) was too broad.”
Advocates of the latest bill, SB 386 by state Sen. Steve Glazer, D-Orinda, argued that the ban would prevent wildfires, curb pollution and protect animals that gobble up cigarette butts, mistaking them for food.
In June, Glazer called cigarette butts “a major polluter on our beaches and oceans.” He could not immediately be reached for comment about Brown’s veto.
J.K. Dineen is a San Francisco Chronicle staff writer. Email: jdineen@sfchronicle.com Twitter: @sfjkdineen
Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Never in my wildest dreams that I thought he would VETO this!
Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.
yrs,
rubato
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Burning Petard
- Posts: 4596
- Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2016 5:35 pm
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Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
I was walking barefoot across the blacktop at a large gas station in my neighborhood when I was about 8 years old. I stepped on a cigarette butt that was still lit--it hurt. Based on that early childhood trauma, I have been strongly anti smokers ever since. In the Army, smokers were subject to severe discipline and ALWAYS had to field strip their butts. [that means dismantling the butt into its separate components . The paper is rolled into a tiny ball and retained with the filter and placed in a pocket. The shreds of tobacco are carefully dropped from the fingers in a manner designed to widely disperse the tiny organic particles.] But always is just an excuse for smokers to defy the rules. Plus us lowly enlisted personnel were subjected to frequent boring tasks called 'policing the area' which meant we lined up shoulder to shoulder and walked slowly together with all eyes on the ground looking for any artificial objects which we pick up--usually cigarette butts and rarely gum or candy wrappers. That re-enforced my emotional bias that all smokers are slobs.
Yes, ban smoking from beaches or any public areas. Smokers continue to abandon their trash in anti-social behavior. Once I managed to retaliate. I was on my bicycle stopped at an intersection and from a car in front of me a lit cigarette butt came out the open driver's window.
I managed to retrieve the butt, walked the bike next to the driver's window and threw it back in to the passenger side. I announced "I think you dropped this'.' and fled away between the stopped cars. Probably never happen again with the proliferation of air conditioning and power windows.
snailgate.
Yes, ban smoking from beaches or any public areas. Smokers continue to abandon their trash in anti-social behavior. Once I managed to retaliate. I was on my bicycle stopped at an intersection and from a car in front of me a lit cigarette butt came out the open driver's window.
I managed to retrieve the butt, walked the bike next to the driver's window and threw it back in to the passenger side. I announced "I think you dropped this'.' and fled away between the stopped cars. Probably never happen again with the proliferation of air conditioning and power windows.
snailgate.
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Beaches have always been large public ashtrays. Littering is still against the law. Smokers are treated like second class citizens nowadays. They are treated like outcasts by hypersensitive whining wimps who have nothing better to do than blame others for their extremely highly unlikely non-existent potential health problems. If they don't want to be near a smoker, let them use their two feet and get the hell away from there. Wear a space helmet and carry an air tank on your back. Better yet, STFU and live with it. Is that the worse thing that's ever happened to you, you sheltered little twerps???
(the above is not addressed to snailgate. It's a Rant & Rave post...
)
(the above is not addressed to snailgate. It's a Rant & Rave post...
)Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
snail - - - - sorry for what happened to you.
I've stepped in dog shyt at times but have no aversion to dogs.
Some people can roll with the punches, I suppose.
I've stepped in dog shyt at times but have no aversion to dogs.
Some people can roll with the punches, I suppose.
Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.
yrs,
rubato
Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
And then there are those who don't toss their butts in the trash.
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.”
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Brown should be careful...“There must be some limits to the coercive power of government.”
That kind of subversive, heretical talk could cost him his Democratic Party membership card...
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
If you crush and properly dispose of your butts, you're the exception not the rule. They are all over our beaches here.
There is nothing that annoys me more than having someone come sit near me on the beach and light up. Get your fucking toxic shit out of my lungs. Go kill yourself in your home or car and get the hell off my beach.
Bad call Jerry. Very bad call.
There is nothing that annoys me more than having someone come sit near me on the beach and light up. Get your fucking toxic shit out of my lungs. Go kill yourself in your home or car and get the hell off my beach.
Bad call Jerry. Very bad call.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké
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Burning Petard
- Posts: 4596
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Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
"Better yet, STFU and live with it. Is that the worse thing that's ever happened to you, you sheltered little twerps???"
Yep. I can get with that. But we all have to draw our own lines and say "Unuff! I ain't gonna put up with it any more!" The events in Los Vegas call attention the the wide differences where each draws their own line. Some times where another has their line seems absurd and unreal.
A while back a student at a college in the Philadelphia area was annoyed by the noise other students were making outside their window late at night. The annoyed one opened the dorm window and shouted at the group to quiet down, calling at least one of the noisy ones 'a water buffalo.'
That crossed somebody's line and the student who used the vile epithet of Water Buffalo was removed from this noble institution of higher learning. When I heard abut this on the local news, In my mind I essentially repeated the line I have quoted at the top of this post.
We all have lines defining the unacceptable and we all find other things various levels of undesirable, but live with them.
Governor Brown accepts the smokers' trash in public places.
snailgate
Yep. I can get with that. But we all have to draw our own lines and say "Unuff! I ain't gonna put up with it any more!" The events in Los Vegas call attention the the wide differences where each draws their own line. Some times where another has their line seems absurd and unreal.
A while back a student at a college in the Philadelphia area was annoyed by the noise other students were making outside their window late at night. The annoyed one opened the dorm window and shouted at the group to quiet down, calling at least one of the noisy ones 'a water buffalo.'
That crossed somebody's line and the student who used the vile epithet of Water Buffalo was removed from this noble institution of higher learning. When I heard abut this on the local news, In my mind I essentially repeated the line I have quoted at the top of this post.
We all have lines defining the unacceptable and we all find other things various levels of undesirable, but live with them.
Governor Brown accepts the smokers' trash in public places.
snailgate
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
If cigarettes aren’t going away, they should all be made filter-less - I agree that smokers who field dress and dispose of butts in garbage receptacles are very much the exception, not the rule. It’s so easy to contain butt filters, all you need is a mostly empty beverage can or bottle - but that’s too much trouble for most disgusting smokers - I say as a former field dressing smoker. I’ve seen people stopped at red lights open the car door and dump their ashtray out on the ground! 
I agree it’s disgusting to be sitting at the beach or camped in a national forest and smell someone’s noxious ciggie smoke - not exactly a positive experience of the great outdoors! When I smoked I was always super respectful of others, especially non-smokers - I would get downwind and far away.
Smoking is a disgusting and deadly habit which should be kept private as much as possible; smokers should keep it at home or in their own vehicle, but if they have kids, I’m fine with laws outlawing them from smoking in their home or vehicle. Children should not be exposed to smoking not just because of the toxicity of secondhand smoke, but because smoking shouldn’t be normalized to them by their loved ones.
I agree it’s disgusting to be sitting at the beach or camped in a national forest and smell someone’s noxious ciggie smoke - not exactly a positive experience of the great outdoors! When I smoked I was always super respectful of others, especially non-smokers - I would get downwind and far away.
Smoking is a disgusting and deadly habit which should be kept private as much as possible; smokers should keep it at home or in their own vehicle, but if they have kids, I’m fine with laws outlawing them from smoking in their home or vehicle. Children should not be exposed to smoking not just because of the toxicity of secondhand smoke, but because smoking shouldn’t be normalized to them by their loved ones.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan
~ Carl Sagan
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
I just realized that I was an abused child. Both of my parents smoked in our house and in the car and always hung around with other child abusers. I remember very well some of the nights when they had family and friends come over with their children so they could all abuse them together.
Many nights they would force me and my brother to play guitars while the younger kids would dance around and play. All the adults would sing along and light their cigarettes and smile as they watched us inhale their toxic gases. Little did we know that we were victims of serious child abuse. It finally makes sense to me why I hyperventilate and want to play the guitar whenever I see an ashtray.
None of us knew what a living hell it was when we were kids. I'm going to write a book. "Mommy and Daddy Dearest".
Many nights they would force me and my brother to play guitars while the younger kids would dance around and play. All the adults would sing along and light their cigarettes and smile as they watched us inhale their toxic gases. Little did we know that we were victims of serious child abuse. It finally makes sense to me why I hyperventilate and want to play the guitar whenever I see an ashtray.
None of us knew what a living hell it was when we were kids. I'm going to write a book. "Mommy and Daddy Dearest".
Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
The "Water Buffalo" Incident: (2013 update)
http://www.phillymag.com/articles/penns ... -20-years/
Eden Jacobowitz eventually received his degree fom UofP and went on to Fordham U and is now a well versed, Jewish, lawyer.
http://www.phillymag.com/articles/penns ... -20-years/
Eden Jacobowitz eventually received his degree fom UofP and went on to Fordham U and is now a well versed, Jewish, lawyer.
“In a world whose absurdity appears to be so impenetrable, we simply must reach a greater degree of understanding among us, a greater sincerity.”
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
A gas station clerk in Bulgaria tried to stop a customer from smoking a cigarette while refueling his car. After a few brief words, security footage shows the clerk opted for the overkill method of resolving the issue.
Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.
yrs,
rubato
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Great article, RayThom. But you needlessly pointed out that the lawyer is Jewish which implies that you believe he's niggardly and offends my sensibilities while destroying my faith in the legal system and humankind in general. I suspect that you are a bully and I am the bullied.RayThom wrote:The "Water Buffalo" Incident: (2013 update)
http://www.phillymag.com/articles/penns ... -20-years/
Eden Jacobowitz eventually received his degree fom UofP and went on to Fordham U and is now a well versed, Jewish, lawyer.
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
All that child abuse probably explains why you grew up to be such a male chauvinist pig...I just realized that I was an abused child. Both of my parents smoked in our house and in the car and always hung around with other child abusers. ...
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
The question of "what are the limits of tolerance" is going to be before us no matter if you use the slogan "PC" or if you have never heard of it. The "water buffalo" case was dropped so in the end nothing worse happened than that people were called to explain themselves publicly; hardly a punishment of any kind. Get over it. Cry babies.
yrs,
rubato
yrs,
rubato
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Actually, I highly admire women.Lord Jim wrote:All that child abuse probably explains why you grew up to be such a male chauvinist pig...
and sometimes when I'm not high....
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
When you were a child there was no scientific basis for concern about secondhand smoke; the surgeon general had just barely released the warning about smoking firsthand.
We now have decades of sound science showing a clear link between secondhand smoke exposure and disease in the exposed, hence the widespread smoking bans in public buildings of all kinds - to protect people who previously had no choice about exposure. Children are especially vulnerable and without agency to remove themselves from exposure, so it is right that the state should intervene where parents are either too stupid or neglectful to care about their children’s health and welfare.
I spent the first 17 years of my life sharing a home and vehicles with two 2/pack/day smokers, and I was sick with upper respiratory infections every year and usually multiple times - I got ear infections so badly a couple of times as a child I ended up in the ER. After I left home, my health improved dramatically - I was sick a few times living in the college dorms, and again when I lived with small kids in school - and I got bronchitis twice during periods in my life when I was smoking more than just socially. Beyond that, my respiratory system has been very healthy and I don’t believe my anecdotal experience is random. I fully expect that if I develop COPD or lung cancer later in life, it will be more because of the 17 years spent living in a blue haze of cigarette smoke than from the very light smoking I engaged in as an adult - which barely adds up to 2 years of smoking altogether.
I don’t believe my parents were abusing me by exposing me to secondhand smoke in the 70s and 80s, but parents who do it now ARE most definitely being very neglectful of their children’s health and that IS a form of child abuse. Those parents are prioritizing their substance use addiction over the well being of the children they owe a duty of care to. It’s routine for child welfare agencies to require parents and guardians to refrain from smoking around children, in the home or in vehicles while the family is working with the child welfare agency. I hope someday it will be prohibited for ALL parents - I don’t care if that’s nanny state to some folks, it’s no different than giving a child drugs or alcohol and it’s as awful as smoking or drinking or drugging in pregnancy.
Don’t have kids if too selfish to prioritize their wellbeing - if that became the universal rule, human society would be 100% healthier both physically and psychologically.
We now have decades of sound science showing a clear link between secondhand smoke exposure and disease in the exposed, hence the widespread smoking bans in public buildings of all kinds - to protect people who previously had no choice about exposure. Children are especially vulnerable and without agency to remove themselves from exposure, so it is right that the state should intervene where parents are either too stupid or neglectful to care about their children’s health and welfare.
I spent the first 17 years of my life sharing a home and vehicles with two 2/pack/day smokers, and I was sick with upper respiratory infections every year and usually multiple times - I got ear infections so badly a couple of times as a child I ended up in the ER. After I left home, my health improved dramatically - I was sick a few times living in the college dorms, and again when I lived with small kids in school - and I got bronchitis twice during periods in my life when I was smoking more than just socially. Beyond that, my respiratory system has been very healthy and I don’t believe my anecdotal experience is random. I fully expect that if I develop COPD or lung cancer later in life, it will be more because of the 17 years spent living in a blue haze of cigarette smoke than from the very light smoking I engaged in as an adult - which barely adds up to 2 years of smoking altogether.
I don’t believe my parents were abusing me by exposing me to secondhand smoke in the 70s and 80s, but parents who do it now ARE most definitely being very neglectful of their children’s health and that IS a form of child abuse. Those parents are prioritizing their substance use addiction over the well being of the children they owe a duty of care to. It’s routine for child welfare agencies to require parents and guardians to refrain from smoking around children, in the home or in vehicles while the family is working with the child welfare agency. I hope someday it will be prohibited for ALL parents - I don’t care if that’s nanny state to some folks, it’s no different than giving a child drugs or alcohol and it’s as awful as smoking or drinking or drugging in pregnancy.
Don’t have kids if too selfish to prioritize their wellbeing - if that became the universal rule, human society would be 100% healthier both physically and psychologically.
For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
~ Carl Sagan
~ Carl Sagan
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
I did that to someone I worked with. However, I used a dry-chemical extinguisher. (Dumbass was changing a fuel line with a Marlboro in his mouth.)dales wrote:A gas station clerk in Bulgaria tried to stop a customer from smoking a cigarette while refueling his car. After a few brief words, security footage shows the clerk opted for the overkill method of resolving the issue.
Treat Gaza like Carthage.
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
I suspect that no matter how one feels about banning smoking on beaches or at parks, we can all agree on banning smoking at gasoline pumps...
See, it is possible to find common ground...
See, it is possible to find common ground...
Re: Gov. Brown, You're My HERO!
Speaking on behalf of all libtards, I'd like to suggest a law that requires gas stations to have Smoking and Non-Smoking gasoline pumps. The mentally challenged are a protected class and this new law will ensure they are treated fairly.