Bill Of Impeachment: Article I, Obstruction Of Justice

[Darren]

I prefer the citizen legislator that hasn't been behaviorally compromised by the system (play along to get along). There's too much of that. I'd rather have an enthusiastic newcomer than a "here's how it works" old timer browbeating the newbies into submission. Along with campaign finance (I agree with that too), the changes might limit the buying and selling of Congress.

As long as Congress is the domain of career politicians, the people will always be sucking hind tit ... at best.

[Crackpot]

You eliminate the option to make a career out of public service and the only option is to make your money and get out. I live in a state with term limits and it's a disaster. Term limits doesn't fix an uninformed electorate it makes the problem worse. All term limits do is force the removal of the rare gold elected official.

[ex-khobar Andy]

I've been saying for 20 years now, pretty much since I finished law school, that the best thing we can do for democracy is campaign finance reform. Of course, the MOTU, particularly those wearing black robes who were chosen by the Republicans, will not let that happen.

I agree with that along with term limits. I'd rather the cozy relationships that allow Congress to be bought and sold not get started.

I agree with both Guin and Darren (there's a sentence beginning I may never use again) about campaign finance reform. For years I did my own taxes, and always checked the box to put $3 (IIRC) towards election funding. My view was and is that an anonymous $3 or even $50 is a small price to pay for some semblance of a level playing field. Then as my income became a little more complex with investments and working overseas etc etc I started to use tax preparation folk from CPAs to HR Block. Without exception they have routinely assumed that I did not want to check that box even though it makes no difference to your tax bill. Based on 2014 figures graphed below, only about 5% of tax returns check that box.



Term limits - I'm with Lord Acton on this - power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely. The only reason you see senators being dragged in front of electors well into their eighties or nineties (Thurmond was still a Senator at 100) is that they accumulate spending power based on seniority and not on ability. It shouldn't be necessary to curtail the career of someone who does a good job as steward of public resources, and maybe campaign finance reform will cure some of the problem, but I think 12 years in Washington and maybe eight in a state capital should be enough.

[Crackpot]

You in what would do you have a career for 12 years or can afford to take a 12 year break from your career? Term limits ensure you only get the rich and connected

[BoSoxGal]

I've been saying for 20 years now, pretty much since I finished law school, that the best thing we can do for democracy is campaign finance reform. Of course, the MOTU, particularly those wearing black robes who were chosen by the Republicans, will not let that happen.

I agree with that along with term limits. I'd rather the cozy relationships that allow Congress to be bought and sold not get started.

No term limits; states that have passed them have seen a breakdown in cooperative legislative relationships that foster productivity beneficial to both parties - it ends up that staffers know more about what’s going on than the newbie legislators. Rigorous finance reform is enough to get us on track, coupled with rigorous limitations on the revolving door between government and K Street.

[Darren]

I've been saying for 20 years now, pretty much since I finished law school, that the best thing we can do for democracy is campaign finance reform. Of course, the MOTU, particularly those wearing black robes who were chosen by the Republicans, will not let that happen.

I agree with that along with term limits. I'd rather the cozy relationships that allow Congress to be bought and sold not get started.

No term limits; states that have passed them have seen a breakdown in cooperative legislative relationships that foster productivity beneficial to both parties - it ends up that staffers know more about what’s going on than the newbie legislators. Rigorous finance reform is enough to get us on track, coupled with rigorous limitations on the revolving door between government and K Street.

I'd go along with campaign finance first (cutting their arm off) as a trial before term limits (hanging them). I realize legislators are "busy." I learned calling DC is a waste of my hot air. What I also learned is much of the staff are career inhabitants of Capitol hill that promote their expertise to stay employed no matter who is in office. When talking to staff is difficult at best, forget about it. Sure career politicians develop expertise. Robert Byrd frequently exposed his copy of the constitution. When the rubber hit the street, it was raw power based on his years of residency that enabled him to tell people to STFU. Based on hearing, "I can't win that battle" I prefer the novice that hasn't given up on tilting at windmills.

[RayThom]

However, a one year term limit for a sitting US president would be great.


... EXCEPT FOR BONE SPURS OF THE FOOT.

[Darren]

However, a one year term limit for a sitting US president would be great.

Relax, Ray! Trump's working on that. Or so I've read from the media. Certainly they wouldn't lie.

[rubato]

Term limits have been a screaming failure in California for reasons which were all predicted in advance.

1. It ensures that no one ever takes on a problem which cannot be solved within the limit.
2. It guarantees that a legislator in his/her second (final) term is not working for the electorate but for their future employer.
3. (related to #1) If a legislator terms out before their initiatives can bear fruit, and they can get credit for them, they will have no motive to succeed.
4. Government is hard. It takes a long time to understand both the details of the practical problems they need to solve and the details of how the government can work to solve them. Limits guarantee that you will have the least experienced and least knowledgeable running things. A recipe for failed government.



yrs,
rubato

[Big RR]

rubato--those are good reasons to avoid term limits for the legislators, but I do think limiting the chief executive to one term could be a good idea, mainly because the executive has so much power that reelection (again and again in some states) could lead to significant problems. I think the CSA had a pretty good idea with one 6 year presidential term.

[Lord Jim]

It's Manafort (and his assistant, Rick Gates):

Paul Manafort, Who Once Ran Trump Campaign, Surrenders to F.B.I.

WASHINGTON — Paul Manafort surrendered to federal authorities Monday morning, after a person close to the case said the first charges were filed in a special counsel investigation.

The charges against Mr. Manafort, President Trump’s former campaign chairman, were not immediately clear but represent a significant escalation in a special counsel investigation that has cast a shadow over the president’s first year in office. Also charged was Mr. Manafort’s former business associate Rick Gates, who was also told to surrender on Monday, the person said.

Mr. Manafort walked into the F.B.I.’s field office in Washington at about 8:15 a.m. with his lawyer.

Mr. Gates is a longtime protégé and junior partner of Mr. Manafort. His name appears on documents linked to companies that Mr. Manafort’s firm set up in Cyprus to receive payments from politicians and businesspeople in Eastern Europe, records reviewed by The New York Times show.

Mr. Manafort had been under investigation for violations of federal tax law, money laundering and whether he appropriately disclosed his foreign lobbying.

Attempts to reach Mr. Gates on Monday were not successful. A spokesman for Mr. Manafort did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

More:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/30/us/p ... icted.html

Since these charges apparently don't relate directly to Manafort's involvement in the campaign, you can now expect that Trump, and his minions, and his sycophants in the press, and his water boys on The Hill, will all be saying, "See! No colusion! No obstruction! Russia and Trump is a ruse! Fake news! Now go get Hillary Clinton!"...

They will also do their best to portray this as the culmination of the investigation rather than what it is...

Just round one...

[Big RR]

And somehow, if Hillary won and her campaign manager was indicted for colluding with the Russians, albeit in another transaction, they wouldn't be yelling "ruse" or "fake news".

[Econoline]

[rubato]

Manafort's actions have been so bad and at such a scale that it would be a staggering injustice to allow him to plead all of them down.


yrs,
rubato

[BoSoxGal]

Bwahahaha!!

[Econoline]

[Lord Jim]

[Lord Jim]

The biggest Russiagate developments this past week were obviously the indictments and plea bargain, but they weren't the the only ones:

Jared Kushner's team turned over documents to special counsel in Russia investigation

(CNN)Jared Kushner has turned over documents in recent weeks to special counsel Robert Mueller as investigators have begun asking in witness interviews about Kushner's role in the firing of FBI Director James Comey, CNN has learned.

Mueller's investigators have expressed interest in Kushner, President Donald Trump's son-in-law and a White House senior adviser, as part of its probe into Russian meddling, including potential obstruction of justice in Comey's firing, sources familiar with the matter said.

Their questions about Kushner signal that Mueller's investigators are reaching the President's inner circle and have extended beyond the 2016 campaign to actions taken at the White House by high-level officials. It is not clear how Kushner's advice to the President might relate to the overall Russia investigation or potential obstruction of justice.

Sources close to the White House say that based on their knowledge, Kushner is not a target of the investigation.

Two separate sources told CNN that investigators have asked other witnesses about Kushner's role in firing Comey. Investigators have also asked about how a statement was issued in the name of Donald Trump Jr. regarding a Trump Tower meeting and about the circumstances surrounding the departures of other White House aides, according to one source. Kushner attended the June 2016 meeting at Trump Tower between top Trump campaign officials and a cadre of Russian figures, including some with links to the Kremlin.

It was arranged after Trump Jr. was told that the Russian government wanted to pass along damaging information about Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton as part of its pro-Trump efforts. The meeting was also attended by Paul Manafort, who was Trump's campaign chairman.
Kushner voluntarily turned over documents he had from the campaign and the transition, and these related to any contacts with Russia, according to a source familiar with the matter. The documents are similar to the ones Kushner gave to congressional investigators.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/02/politics/ ... index.html

Trump and Sessions Denied Knowing About Russian Contacts. Records Suggest Otherwise.

WASHINGTON — Standing before reporters in February, President Trump said unequivocally that he knew of nobody from his campaign who was in contact with Russians during the election. Attorney General Jeff Sessions has told the Senate the same thing.

Court documents unsealed this week cast doubt on both statements and raised the possibility that Mr. Sessions could be called back to Congress for further questioning.

The special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, unsealed his first charges Monday in a wide-ranging investigation into Russian attempts to disrupt the presidential election and whether anyone close to Mr. Trump was involved. Records in that case show that George Papadopoulos, a foreign policy adviser, had frequent discussions with Russians in 2016 and trumpeted his connections in front of Mr. Trump and Mr. Sessions.

For months, journalists have revealed evidence that associates of Mr. Trump met with Russians during the campaign and the presidential transition. But the court documents represent the first concrete evidence that Mr. Trump was personally told about ties between a campaign adviser and Russian officials.

More:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/02/us/p ... ussia.html

Exclusive: Carter Page testifies he told Sessions about Russia trip

(CNN)Former Trump foreign policy adviser Carter Page privately testified Thursday that he mentioned to Jeff Sessions he was traveling to Russia during the 2016 presidential campaign — as new questions emerge about the attorney general's comments to Congress about Russia and the Trump campaign.

During more than six hours of closed-door testimony, Page said that he informed Sessions about his coming July 2016 trip to Russia, which Page told CNN was unconnected to his campaign role. Page described the conversation to CNN after he finished talking to the House intelligence committee.

Sessions' discussion with Page will fuel further scrutiny about what the attorney general knew about connections between the Trump campaign and Russia — and communications about Russia that he did not disclose despite a persistent line of questioning in three separate hearings this year.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/02/politics/ ... index.html

[RayThom]

... Sources close to the White House say that based on their knowledge, Kushner is not a target of the investigation.

Yeah, right... I got a bridge to sell you.

And don't forget Ivanka. Daddy's taking measurements to make sure she also fits under the already overcrowded bus.


The Kingdom Is Crumbling.

[Lord Jim]

I saw Baghdad Sarah earlier this week claiming that they had some "information" that Mueller was getting ready to "wrap up" the investigation...

Maybe she misspoke and meant to say "ramp up"....

Looks to me like their "knowledge" and "information" ain't so good...

They could really use some better sources....