The latest in a long line of never going to happen proposals, or an actual possibility?
California to vote on splitting into 3 states 00:30
(CNN)An initiative that would divide California into three separate states qualified Tuesday to appear on the ballot in November's general election.
Californians will vote whether to separate into three states: California, Northern California and Southern California -- subject to approval by US Congress.
The proposal by venture capitalist, Tim Draper to break up California in a campaign called "Cal 3," received more than 402,468 valid signatures -- surpassing the amount required by state law.
California Secretary of State Alex Padilla will certify the initiative as qualified for the November 6th ballot on June 28.
Draper has said that partitioning California into three states would allow regional communities to make better and more sensible decisions for their citizens to address the state's most pressing issues, including the school systems, high taxes, deteriorating infrastructure and strained government.
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"It will simply divide the state into smaller, more manageable populations. Think of North Carolina and South Carolina; North Dakota and South Dakota; West Virginia and Virginia -- California is already known for its Northern and Southern identities," according to the Cal 3 website.
But critics have slammed the partition effort as a distraction and say that breaking up the state would cost billions of tax dollars.
Under the proposal, each state would have about 12.3 million to 13.9 million people.
California- This would include six counties: Los Angeles, Ventura, Santa Barbara, San Luis Obispo, Monterey and San Benito counties.
Southern California- This would include 12 counties: San Diego, San Bernardino, Orange, Riverside, Mono, Madera, Inyo, Tulare, Fresno, Kings, Kern and Imperial counties.
Northern California- This would include 40 counties including the San Francisco Bay Area and the remaining counties north of Sacramento.
What are the chances of this happening?
If the measure is approved by voters, the governor will transfer the notice of state approval to Congress, which will vote to ratify the creation of the new three-state structure.
Constitutional lawyer and professor Jonathan Turley had told CNN that congressional approval is not impossible, but not likely to happen, as Democrats could feel they have too much to lose.
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This isn't the first time that Draper attempted to get an initiative to break apart the most populous state. He backed a proposal to turn California into six states in 2014 but it failed to get the required number of signatures to qualify and the measure was not presented to voters.
Last year, an effort dubbed Calexit sought to bring the question of whether California should secede from the US to this year's ballot. But the Russia-based leader of that campaign backed off.
Plenty of ideas about splintering California into smaller states have popped up -- including an effort by rural, more conservative northern counties that seek to break away to become "State of Jefferson." Another group proposes the creation of another state called New California, comprising mostly inland counties, over grievances of high-state taxes, regulation and single party politics.
The latest in a long line of never going to happen proposals
Yes.
The more interesting question is whether this is part of a long-term strategy and this is one small step to a time when this could actually become a reality. There was mindless chatter about splitting up California, then what-if thinking, including logistics and costs, then a failed attempt to get on the ballot, and now a successful attempt to get on the ballot (and will go down in flames with the voters, and certainly with Congress), and then whatever is next. If the idea keeps circling and the logistics getting better vetting, is it remotely possible that in our lifetimes this could happen? I can't imagine the circumstances, and this likely is just an appearance of moving the concept forward based on a rich guy's effort.
Big RR wrote:Well, if California got 6 instead of 2 senate seats, it could get interesting--which is why it's not going to happen.
This proposal seems designed to guarantee at least two Republican senate seats (and potentially more, depending on how the votes of the L.A.-centred state swing) and thus is probably intended to overcome objections on that basis.
"Hang on while I log in to the James Webb telescope to search the known universe for who the fuck asked you." -- James Fell
What's up with that? Traditional separation of powers. Intentionally the District of Columbia has little power in the legislature--for the same reason that the Supreme Court and POTUS have no voice or vote in Congress. However, by gradual evolution, the DC court has enormous influence in the Judicial branch. It is one of the most important federal appeals courts.
The residents of DC have ZERO representation in Congress - taxation without representation, and all that nonsense that was the basis of the American Revolution. And it is a wrong that could easily be righted without constitutional amendment or the creation of a new state.
"Hang on while I log in to the James Webb telescope to search the known universe for who the fuck asked you." -- James Fell
How would this be accomplished? The 23rd amendment had to be enacted to permit DC residents to vote for president, and Article 1 limits legislative representation to the several states. I think DC would either have to become a state or we would need a new constitutional amendment to get DC voting representation in congress. They could have an observer much as Puerto Rico and USVI do, but not voting reps.
Maintain the federal district prescribed in the Constitution by carving out those areas that are solely governmental/institutional in nature. Would be a fairly contiguous area with a few "islands". Then cede the remainder back to the state of Maryland from which it came. No new state, no constitutional amendment required. The 23rd Amendment would become inoperative by virtue of the fact that there would no longer be any mechanism for electing presidential electors from DC.
Last edited by Scooter on Thu Jun 14, 2018 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Hang on while I log in to the James Webb telescope to search the known universe for who the fuck asked you." -- James Fell
Perhaps, but then part came from Virginia as well, so there would have to be a division, and I am not sure either state would want DC to be a part of it since there are a number of very poor people in it who would have to be provided for.
I do recall a number of years ago the House tried to pass a bill giving DC a voting House rep arguing that they had the power to decide their own membership and the power to govern DC, so they could ttreat it as a state, but many argued such is not the case. As I recall, it did not pass.
The part that came from Virginia was ceded back to it before the Civil War. I don't know if Maryland would agree to this plan, but along with a lot of poor people comes a lot of wealth (note the stats above).
It would clearly be unconstitutional, as the document is presently written, to give congressional representation to anyone not part of a state. Whether a state could be carved out of DC (while leaving behind a federal district as required by the Constitution) is not clear to me, but the fact that it would add two perpetually Democratic senators would make this a dead letter unless Democrats again regain a Senate supermajority and use it for this purpose.
"Hang on while I log in to the James Webb telescope to search the known universe for who the fuck asked you." -- James Fell
Scooter wrote:Maintain the federal district prescribed in the Constitution by carving out those areas that are solely governmental/institutional in nature. Would be a fairly contiguous area with a few "islands". Then cede the remainder back to the state of Maryland from which it came. No new state, no constitutional amendment required. The 23rd Amendment would become inoperative by virtue of the fact that there would no longer be any mechanism for electing presidential electors from DC.
That was my first thought too. Shrink DC down the to seats of government and Federal agencies and give the rest back to Maryland. Maryland would gain 1 congressperson as well.
