People are Going Ape Over DeSantis Comment

[Joe Guy]

DeSantis: Andrew Gillum Would 'Monkey this up'
Gina Martinez
3-4 minutes

Florida Republican gubernatorial candidate Ron DeSantis is being criticized after saying that his Democratic opponent, Andrew Gillum, would “monkey this up.” If elected, Gillum would be Florida’s first black governor.

Ron DeSantis appeared on Fox News Channel’s America’s Newsroom Wednesday morning following Gillum’s unexpected primary victory. He called the Tallahasee mayor charismatic, but said he is too far to the left. Gillum ran on several progressive policies, including gun reform, LGBTQ rights and universal healthcare.

“The last thing we need to do is to monkey this up by trying to embrace a socialist agenda with huge tax increases and bankrupting the state,” DeSantis said. “That’s not going to work, that’s not going to be good for Florida.” he added.

Some observers saw DeSantis’ use of the term “monkey this up” as a racist insult.

“It’s disgusting that Ron DeSantis is launching his general election campaign with racist dog whistles,” said Terrie Rizzo, head of the Florida Democratic Party.

Others also blasted DeSantis for his word choice:

DeSantis spokesperson Dave Vasquez told NBC News that the term was not meant to be racist, and that “monkeying” refers to doing something incorrectly.

“At the end of the day it was nothing more than the expression he was using in order to make a point that something was messed up or things weren’t done right,” he said.

America’s Newsroom host Sandra Smith released a statement in response to the backlash. Smith said her show does not condone the language used and wanted viewers to be aware that DeSantis has since clarified his statement.

Gillum himself responded on Fox’s Shephard Smith Reporting Wednesday afternoon, saying “it’s very clear that Mr. DeSantis is taking a page directly from the campaign manual of Donald Trump, but I think he’s got another thing coming to him if he thinks that in today’s day in age Florida voters are going to respond to that level of derision and division — they’re sick of it.”

“What we’re trying to offer in this race is a north star for where we want to go as a state,” he continued.

President Donald Trump tweeted his support for DeSantis on Monday.

source

This is getting ridiculous, embarrassing and predictable. If there's any chance of misinterpreting someone's words into something racist or some other type of terrible hateful thing, the victim-minded idiots on the boob tube and interfuckingnet will become outraged and let everyone know about it for as long as possible. I hate people.

[BoSoxGal]

You’re a blithering idiot who hasn’t been paying attention if you can’t see that comment for the racist dog whistle - foghorn! - that it is.

You’re the kind of people you should be sick of - and many of us really fucking are sick of the racist apologists among us.

[Joe Guy]

I guess you're the kind of person who looks for things to offend you. How many people would even know they're supposed to be an outraged victim if this story wasn't plastered all over the media by people telling you how you should feel about it?

[BoSoxGal]

Apologists for racists are no different in these times than saying or believing the stuff yourself. I know you’re not so stupid as to think what he said was a slip of the tongue or not intentional - which means what you are in my book is a good little Nazi along for the ride. Or, you’re just a twisted fuck who likes to rile people up. Either way, you are what’s wrong with this country today and you make me sick.

[BoSoxGal]

Really Joe Guy, you are one sick fucking pup. I bet you had an orgasm over crafting that thread title and starting this thread with that fucked up post, and the fucked up follow up, too. What a pathetic existence you must lead.

eta: Feel free to go to town with all the nasty comments you’ll be making about me to stroke your own sad ego; I’ll never read another one of your posts so I won’t even know it, and any of your buddies here that enjoy it and agree with your racist sympathies aren’t worth hearing either. Assholes like you are fucking this country up and it’s past time for calling you on your shit.

[Econoline]

Joe - I, personally, am not a victim of racism. However...I, personally, *AM* offended by the blatant racism of DeSantis' comment. Nobody told me to be offended. I didn't go looking for something to offend me. I'm not an outraged victim; I'm an outraged citizen.

Are you suggesting that the news media (a.k.a. "the MSM" by the right wing or "the non-Fox media" by the rest of us) should *NOT* cover comments like this when a Republican Congressman says such things on Fox News? He knew what he was saying, and he knew the audience he was saying it to, and he should have absolutely no expectation that that audience would be the only people who would hear him.

[Joe Guy]

Well, BSG, I could lower myself to your level and hurl insults at you for having a different opinion than mine, but I won't. The truth is that I don't see anything racist in what DeSantis said. I believe he would have said the same about a democrat white candidate - and if he had done that, would there be outrage?

Are we not supposed to use the M word now?

[Joe Guy]

Well, Econoline, I could raise myself to your level and not hurl insults at you so I will. I've heard and used the phrase monkey it up, monkey around and other monkey comments and never imagined it had any negative connotation to black people. If I said 'monkey it up' to a white person is that the same as calling a white person the N word? Why or why not?

[Bicycle Bill]

Personally I think this just so much monkey business, but the last thing I need these days is to be perceived as being involved in any racist monkeyshines.  So I suppose I'd better get rid of my monkey wrenches and cut the monkey-fists off the ropes in my camping gear.  And I guess it's "bye-bye" to my great-niece's sock-monkey doll and her "Barrel of Monkeys" game too.

I have no reason to support truly racist/hateful speech or Ron DeSantis in this matter, but despite your own biases, BSG, sometimes a cigar IS just a cigar.

-"BB"-

[Joe Guy]

[RayThom]

I, too, read and heard DeSantis' comments as racist.

In all of the elections over the last few years -- primaries or general -- I do not recall one candidate using the term "monkey this up" when referring to the opposition. I'm not a big believer in consequences so I find it very hard not to feel this was a definite dog whistle blown by a Drumpf endorsed sycophant to mock a much stronger black opponent.

And if this sounds like a monkey wrench thrown into the racist epithet grist mill -- then let it be so.

[Lord Jim]

Well...

I think that to evaluate this kind of thing, context is very important...And it's my opinion that based on the context:

The fact that the term was used by a candidate who has gone over the top in his efforts to associate himself with our Racist Dog Whistler-In-Chief...Here's one of the campaign ads he ran:



Makes it is certainly far more likely than not that DeSantis used this term for the purpose of sending a wink and a dog whistle to motivate the racist Trumpanzee faction to get out and vote for him, while trying to do so in a way that would preserve some plausible deniability ...

Given the context of his long standing allegiance to and involvement with Trump, (and thus his understanding of how Trump himself operates in communicating his sympathies to his racist supporters) I find DeSantis' denial that he was deliberately pandering to racists by choosing to use that term cynical and unconvincing...

That having been said...

I also don't find someone honestly taking an opposing view on this as justification for calling them "a blithering idiot" or a "racist apologist" or " one sick fucking pup"...

(A position which will now no doubt earn me a "fuck you too" and probably a "racist apologist" smear as well...)

[BoSoxGal]

I’m not going to call you any names LJ, because I think you’re a decent citizen with a proper level of concern about the sickness that is twisting our politics and civil discourse.

Joe, on the other hand, has antagonized me repeatedly over the years and is a puke, period. He’s not an unintelligent person, which leaves only two choices: he’s a racist prick who accepts and celebrates the current sickness infesting our politics, or he’s just taking a twisted pleasure in the pain of millions of his fellow citizens and in seeing his country torn to shreds by racist idealogues. Both of these things are unacceptable and make him, in my opinion, a piece of shit. I’m unrepentant in that position; the gloves are off and people like me aren’t going to politely suffer racists anymore.

I’m sick to death of old white racist men and frankly grateful to be one of the youngest people posting here, for obvious reasons.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Here in South Africa my US-honed sensitivity alarm tends to go off only in the context of ideas that "white" represents good and "black" stands for evil. Even Christians note this and one thankfully begins to see that color demonstrations of the gospel are switching to gold for good and perhaps red for bad. . . no one cares if the SACP complains.

Recent media storms have been ignited by the continuing tendency of some Afrikaaners to use the "k-word" which is 'kaffir' - equivalent to the "N-word" in the USA.

March 2018 "Former real estate agent Vicki Momberg was sentenced to an effective two years in prison by the Randburg Magistrate's Court on Wednesday for her racist tirade in 2016...She was found guilty on four counts of crimen injuria on November 3 in connection with her rant, which started when she lashed out at a black police officer who had helped her after an alleged smash-and-grab incident in Northriding, Johannesburg."

August 2018 "A racist rant in which a South African man films himself boasting about being on a Greek beach where there isn't a single black person in sight has left his family business reeling. In the video, Adam Catzavelos gives a weather report, adding "amazing sea and not one k*ff*r in sight". He has since been fired from the family business, St George's Fine Foods, and one client of the company has already decided to find another supplier"

Now, it is not up to me to decide whether the word "kaffir" is offensive. It is not up to me to leap to the defense of the word-user to explain that no one should be offended; that a black South African should make allowances and so on.

Howard Cosell used the word "monkey" quite often in referring to smaller or nippy (uh oh) football player black or white. But he offended far more people in later years when their antenna were more attuned to the INSENSITIVITY of the expression "See that little monkey run!" - didn't help that the better, faster, dodgier players were by now almost all black. Whether Cosell was racist, even unconsciously, is highly debatable. But it is not up to me, or any white person, to judge that black people should not be offended and that the media should not report such reactions.

Nobody says "monkey up" to mean making a mess of things. "Monkeying around" is used a lot to indicate pointless and fruitless activity. But in this day and age, DeSantis (or anyone) surely is aware and knows that when speaking of a black person it is utterly wrong to use words such as "monkey" in any context. If he doesn't know it, he is a fool. Since he probably isn't a fool, he did it on purpose.

As to bringing up "monkey wrenches", that's just puerile

[Lord Jim]

Since he probably isn't a fool, he did it on purpose.

DeSantis definitely isn't a fool:

He graduated from Yale University with a B.A. in History in 2001 and from Harvard Law School with a J.D. in 2005.[8]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_DeSantis

He also had a very distinguished stint as a JAG attorney and worked as a federal prosecutor before being elected to Congress in 2012...

He's a very intelligent, very well educated, skilled and cynical political operator ...

Sort of a Ted Cruz type...

He threw in hard with Trump after the 2016 election because he knew that would be very beneficial to him running statewide in Florida in a GOP primary, and his strategy worked brilliantly. He entered the gubernatorial race as a decided underdog, and rode his alliance with Trump to a 20 point victory.

This is a very bright fellow, a careful, deliberate and thoughtful man, who studied Trump's techniques closely and applied them deliberately and effectively to get the nomination. He has a thorough understanding of Trump's core constituencies and what motivates them. His primary victory proves that.

The chances that somebody like this could have used the term he did innocently with no agenda in mind approach absolute zero...

Could anyone theoretically have done this innocently, with no race pandering intent? Yes, that's possible.

Could this guy? With his background and knowledge base?

No way.

[Big RR]

That's pretty much what I thought as well; he's clearly smart enough to know what he's saying, and he's clearly using that word rile up his supporters.

[Crackpot]

Being smart does not necessarily men one has common sense.

[Big RR]

True, but political success usually goes hand in hand with a knowledge of words and how to use them to excite, incite, and even manipulate. There are exceptions, but I don't think this guy is one--I think he knew exactly what he was saying and doing, even to the point of giving himself the "Who me?" out.

[Lord Jim]

This guy had just won the GOP primary for the Florida gubernatorial nomination by knowing exactly how to appeal to and motivate Trump supporters, and the very next day he goes on Fox News and says this...

And some how that's supposed to be some sort of innocent slip up?

[Lord Jim]

Look, people over-interpreting things as racist that aren't because of their own agendas is a real thing...

I saw a really good example of this on one of the news shows this morning, when somebody tried to resurrect that BS about how calling a black person "articulate" is "racist" because nobody refers to white people as "articulate"; it's just assumed that they are...

(Complete load of crap; tell George W Bush about how it's just assumed that white people are "articulate". Our current miserable excuse for a President frequently isn't even coherent, let alone articulate...)

And it's very unfortunate when this over use of the word "racist" happens, because it has the effect of trivializing real racism and devaluing words and deeds that have actual racist intent...

But it's clear from the total context that this isn't a case of looking for racist intent where none exists...

ETA:

Maybe DeSantis (or somebody else) can come up with proof of an earlier quote or quotes from him using this expression (which as Meade points out, isn't at all a common expression. This is certainly the first time I'd ever heard it; the only expression that I can think of that conveys the same meaning that sounds remotely similar is "muck up"...) and applying it to white people as well as black people...

If so, then maybe there would be a "benefit of the doubt" case to be made that there was not racist intent behind his using it in this case...

But I certainly won't hold my breath waiting for that...