Another COVID-19 Thread

[TPFKA@W]

I agree, and wish her a speedy recovery as well. As for high fevers, I recall from my kids that, when they were young, they could spike very high fevers (much higher than most adults would tolerate) and then and then recover quickly--I wish her the same.

That was what I tried to explain to her completely freaked out father and grandfather. Father was crying so hard we could hardly understand what he was telling us.

This was her last week.

IMG_2446[481].PNG (82.37 KiB) Viewed 1665 times

[Big RR]

It is scary, especially with the all Covid all the time press coverage; hopefully she'll bounce back quickly--she looks like a happy little girl.

[eddieq]

Wishing a speedy and complete recovery for the little one (and really, all who are infected). Stay safe all!

[Bicycle Bill]

Not just it’s doggies. My cat is never happier than when I’m at home with him.

And now, the continuing saga of
G U I N E V E R E ' S    C A T

-"BB"-

[ex-khobar Andy]

I just stepped away from my tv, as POTUS made another live news conference. I full agree with the Madox post above.

Why does testing seem to have such a high priority? The people to be tested all have symptoms. The symptoms need to be treated. IF THEY TEST POSITIVE, the treatment remains exactly the same. There is no other treatment for this disease. If they test positive, they have already been contagious and spreading the disease for many days. Why have so many political authorities imposed travel restrictions?---because real quarantine is the only thing that works to stop this pandemic.

snailgate

Testing early on asymptomatic people is important because it will show who is carrying the virus BEFORE they show symptoms. So there is a chance to (a) isolate that individual before s/he starts to cough over all of us and (b) trace their contacts so that they too can be watched. Basically that's what S Korea did and why they have (relatively speaking) so little occurrence of the disease. You can be CoV-positive long before COVID-19 shows up. If you have a very limited supply of test kits then of course you have to use it on anyone showing the symptoms but by then it's too late for trying to prevent spread and its use is purely clinical rather than epidemiological. That's why when the president says "Anyone who wants one can have a test" it is a big fucking lie and a clear and present danger to the people of this country. To show how screwed up I am, I want him to stand aside and let Mike Pence handle it. Those words - let Mike Pence handle it - are words I could not have imagined writing months ago under any circumstance. One of my arguments against impeachment (how innocent we all were those few months ago) was that even if successful we would get President Pence.

One day the story of the US and testing will be written and I look forward to reading it. The testing isn't difficult - it involves reverse transcriptase polymerase chain reaction for RNA which IDs the virus. It's not a difficult technique for trained personnel and the technology has been around for years. All you need are some primers - easy to say, but that really is not a very difficult technique to master compared to how it was 20 years ago. For the technically minded I recall buying primers at $200 per base pair maybe 15 years ago when we were chasing white spot virus in shrimp, and now it's often less than $5 per base pair.

I don't know why the Korean test which seemed to work there did not catch on here in the US. I suspect (but don't know) that there was some move to use a US-developed test rather than some nasty foreign test so that US companies could reap the benefit. It may be (again I don't know and maybe we won't until the dust settles) that foreign manufacturers were reluctant to give the details to US for IP reasons. However it happened and whoever was responsible, there is no doubt that we missed the testing boat by a month or more.

[Bicycle Bill]

And now we start getting creative in order to stay in business —

Restaurant sees 'extraordinary' success after making surprising adjustment: ‘I'm at a loss really'

A restaurant near Chicago is experiencing major success after making one crucial adjustment to its menu.

The Beacon Tap, located in Des Plaines, Ill., announced a new deal the week of March 16 — just as restaurants across the country were moving away from in-store service.  In order to encourage customers to dine with them without actually coming inside, the restaurant is now offering a free roll of toilet paper with every delivery or take-out order, WMAQ-TV reports.

The move comes amid a nationwide shortage of toilet paper, which began as Americans started stocking up for an extended period of stay-at-home time. And apparently, the idea is working.
(more)

-"BB"-

[rubato]

I am astonished that the one thing we need most urgently to do is not happening. We need to test to track the infection and to isolate people who are infectious. My BIL, a perinatologist with Kaiser, is sick with mild covid-like symptoms and cannot be tested.

I cannot believe that the country who invented reverse transcriptase (thank you Kerry Mullis) and who invented a fast screening method which showed that SARs was a coronavirus* (Thank you Joseph DeRisi) can't do better than this.

yrs,
rubato

* A billion-dollar technology which De Risi gave away by publishing it in a journal.

[rubato]

'...
Why does testing seem to have such a high priority? The people to be tested all have symptoms. The symptoms need to be treated. IF THEY TEST POSITIVE, the treatment remains exactly the same. There is no other treatment for this disease. If they test positive, they have already been contagious and spreading the disease for many days. Why have so many political authorities imposed travel restrictions?---because real quarantine is the only thing that works to stop this pandemic.

snailgate

No, wee need a test to be able to isolate infectious people who are asymptomatic. And we need a test to have an accurate picture of the spread of the virus.

yrs,
rubato

[ex-khobar Andy]

Rotterdam Philharmonic gave us all something. 4 minutes you will not regret spending.

[ex-khobar Andy]

* A billion-dollar technology which De Risi gave away by publishing it in a journal.

I don't know this story but I'm glad to hear that altruism is not dead.

A few months ago there was a Bloomberg piece on how the feds were trying to purge Chinese researchers out of US cancer labs. The rationale was that they would take their American-made discoveries to the dirty low down cheating Chinese Communists who would of course make all the $$$$. This has a definite echo in Trump’s odious attempt to buy a German company which is apparently showing early in the race to find a coronavirus vaccine, and the Administration’s attempt to make that eventual vaccine available only to Americans.

I’ll tell you a story about my first real job. I was 17 and had almost a year to kill before my selected university would take me. I had passed all the exams from my boarding school in England and my parental units were overseas. What are we going to do with the kid? So Ps and the Headmaster hatched a plan: young Andrew could get a job and live at school. Unilever were looking for a lab tech to run a bank of gas liquid chromatography (GLC; later just GC) units at their flavor research lab. They wisely chose me. Thus it was that Andrew became probably the only schoolboy in England with a full time 40 hour a week job. I have worked with GCs for around 50 years now.

First day on the job I sat down with the lab director, Ray Scott. Chances are good that one or two of the chemists on this board have read RPW Scott’s books on GC and HPLC detectors. He invented or perfected some of them and at one point worked closely with James Lovelock (as in Gaia Hypothesis and electron capture detector) who is still with us and who turns 101 in July. Ray Scott did much to develop capillary columns (this will impress precisely two of you) which are known as Support Coated Open Tubular or SCOT columns. The name is a sort of forced acronym to honor Dr. Scott.

I knew nothing about GC. However that could soon be rectified. “Go down the corridor and knock on Dr. James’s door and he will teach you what you need to know.” I spent the morning with Dr James and his soft Yorkshire accent. A lot of it went over my head and at one point I recall him looking me: “I suppose this is all Greek to you!” Although I had by then four science A Levels (I expect this to impress exactly none of you) my real love was the Classics. However and luckily, something in me told me that it was probably not a good idea to respond like a smart-arse “Well actually I’d prefer it if it were Greek because I’d understand it better.”

What I didn’t know than was that Anthony James had invented GC. The original GC paper in 1952 was by James and AJP Martin, and it described this novel technique for separating organic compounds. Nowadays GCs are commonplace - probably around $60K for a decent one and I have over the course of a career been responsible for buying maybe 30 of them and I have probably used about 100. So they are everywhere. AJP Martin was awarded the Nobel Prize in 1952. Why Tony James did not get a Nobel I shall never know.

A year or two ago I found a biography of Tony James self published by the author. He’d worked with Dr James two or three years after my lab tech days. What I didn’t know was that Tony James had been an old-style communist (remember they were our allies in WW2) and become disillusioned with them in 1956 after the Hungarian invasion. It’s a longer story than that. Anyway, he and Martin did not patent GC because they saw its use as being primarily for public health and they did not want to inhibits its development.

Tony James died in 2006 IIRC. He died as a much appreciated scientist who had made a huge contribution to knowledge, human health and the environment. He could have been mega-wealthy too, if he and Martin had patented their invention. It sounds to me as if De Risi - as Rube posted - is from the same mold.

[rubato]

DeRisi is a product of UCSC and Stanford and as brilliant as they come. He is also unfailingly generous to co-workers unlike a lot of senior scientists (Linus, are you listening?). He lab announced a breakthrough in malaria research with an organelle. Instead of hogging the stage he pushed forward the Stanford MD/PhD working with him and made sure she got all the credit and was able to describe her own work.

He well on his way to Nobel prize quality work.

In 2004 DeRisi was named a MacArthur fellow (the "Genius" award), in 2008 was awarded the 14th Annual Heinz Award for Technology, the Economy, and Employment, and in 2014 he received the John J. Carty Award for the Advancement of Science from the National Academy of Sciences. In 2016 he was elected to the National Academy of Sciences.[4]

He was involved in the development of the ViroChip, which is used to rapidly identify viruses in bodily fluids. It was used to help identify the Severe acute respiratory syndrome virus in 2003. He has also been involved in the development of an online platform called IDseq, backed by the Chan Zuckerberg Initiative which is used to identify viruses from metagenomic sequencing data.[5]

JBS Haldane is one of my favorite "cranks" in the sciences and a communist supporter dating from the depression era. Brilliant in multiple areas and served in the tranches in WW I. I don't think he ever repented. But he did write a wonderful doggerel poem called "cancer can be rather fun" to make up for it;

"I wish I had the voice of Homer
to sing of rectal carcinoma
which kills a lot more chaps in fact
than were bumped off when troy was sacked. … "

"... now I am like the Greek god Janus
the only god who can see his anus... "

A famous athiest, he was asked what he thought of the almighty to which he said "he has an inordinate fondness for beetles".

[MajGenl.Meade]

South Africa will be in "lock-down" for 21 days commencing this coming Thursday. We can go shopping but only for essential supplies - so wine, food, wine, and medicine. And wine. Easy enough for people situated as we are to make as light of it (while obeying it 100%) as we do. It's a defense mechanism - imagine Margaretta's horror when she realized it meant that I WOULD BE HERE 24/7 except when she sends me shopping. Or goes herself; apparently there's a decent store in Cape Town that might have fresh canapes.

There is no grocery delivery service that will reach us.We do have running water and electricity (Eskom keeps that working on most days); we have several different rooms we can live in; we can embark on painting the four that remain to be done; the DSTV offers some entertainment, even some classic football games from back in the mists of time (2008).

But this country is full of townships and informal settlements where washing one's hands every few minutes is not on - they have no water, except perhaps for a common stand-pipe. There are many, many one room mokaku structures. There's no amusement to keep the kids and no place either - so they are out in the streets (alleged streets). Perhaps that's not so bad. The Centre started to provide some food and activities for 25 or so on Monday but now must either stop doing so or defy the law. Will the police visit those neighborhoods? Probably not - they don't now. The "beggars" at every red light downtown will lose big-time; no one wants to open a car window. The sunglasses and power supply cords for cell phones will remain unpurchased from the street people. From those who have next to nothing, even that will be taken away.

We fortunate ones anticipate road blocks on the main highways as the police check destinations - waving the workers' buses and taxis through perhaps or maybe not. They can't stop people from going shopping but they can (and will) create long traffic jams to deter the casual traveler. And still, we count ourselves among the most fortunate and look for opportunities to serve somebody without violating the social spacing that is vital to stop this thing.

It's like being in Ohio

[Gob]

It's like being in Ohio

Or, for the Poms, Camborne.

[MajGenl.Meade]

Support for the man on the bike. Old farts never die quietly enough; they just play "I see you":

As the coronavirus continues to spread in the United States, forcing people to stay in their homes and causing an economic downturn, Lieutenant Governor of Texas, Dan Patrick, joined Tucker Carlson Tonight where he made headlines by suggesting we get back to our normal lives to save the economy even at great risk to the country’s senior citizens. Patrick, who turns 70 next week, believes it’s up to older Americans to take that risk.

“Tucker, no one reached out to me and said, ‘As a senior citizen, are you willing to take a chance on your survival in exchange for keeping the America that all America loves for your children and grandchildren?’ And if that’s the exchange, I’m all in,” Patrick said, later adding, “My message is, let’s get back to work. Let’s get back to living. Let’s be smart about it, and those of us who are 70-plus, we’ll take care of ourselves.”

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2020/0 ... /23959897/

[MajGenl.Meade]

Ah, it's a chorus line.

The President admitted Monday that "certainly, this is going to be bad," on the deadliest day in America's struggle with the pandemic, but he argued that "if it were up to the doctors, they may say let's keep it shut down -- let's shut down the entire world."

Trump's change of emphasis previewed a building confrontation inside his own administration -- between public health officials using the science of epidemiology to battle Covid-19 and political and economic officials desperate to save an economy that is fundamental to basic life and Trump's reelection hopes.

The President's upbeat prediction of a return to full speed ahead directly contradicted the actions of state governors nationwide -- who are imposing stay-at-home orders, closing businesses and ordering schools out for summer in March.

Plus (sshhhhhh!) Fauci has been disappeared.

President Trump has praised Dr. Anthony S. Fauci as a “major television star.” He has tried to demonstrate that the administration is giving him free rein to speak. And he has deferred to Dr. Fauci’s opinion several times at the coronavirus task force’s televised briefings.

But Dr. Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases since 1984, has grown bolder in correcting the president’s falsehoods and overly rosy statements about the spread of the coronavirus in the past two weeks — and he has become a hero to the president’s critics because of it. And now, Mr. Trump’s patience has started to wear thin.

[Gob]

Why self-medicating is never a good idea!

A woman has spoken out after she and her husband both drank a fish tank cleaner called chloroquine - thinking it was the potential coronavirus treatment called hydroxychloroquine that Donald Trump has promoted at his press conferences - and her husband died.

The unidentified woman and her husband, both in their 60s, ingested chloroquine phosphate, confusing it with hydroxychloroquine, an antimalaria drug that's shown promising results in treating COVID-19 patients.

Her husband died and she was left in critical condition after drinking the chemical.

The woman told NBC: 'We were afraid we were getting sick. We were getting really worried.' She said they had been self isolating before each taking a teaspoon of the toxic chemical with soda.

She added: 'We saw his [Trump's] press conference. It was on a lot, actually. Trump kept saying it was pretty much a cure.

Referring to hydroxychloroquine she said: 'They kept saying that it was approved for other things.'

[TPFKA@W]

Update on the kiddo. They released her from the hospital without saying whether or nay she has the virus. The family is quarantined for the next 14 days. They want the baby separated from the others but how one does that with one still in diapers I cannot imagine. Hubby took a big box of food over and left it on the porch while they waved from the window.

[MajGenl.Meade]

That's good news in the mix - surely they would have said if she DID have it? Bless 'em all.

Meanwhile, in the world of Trumpaholics:

Nigeria reported two cases of chloroquine poisoning after U.S. President Donald Trump praised the anti-malaria drug as a treatment for the novel coronavirus.

Health officials are warning Nigerians against self-medicating after demand for the drug surged in Lagos, a city that’s home to 20 million people. Two people were hospitalized in Lagos for chloroquine overdoses, Oreoluwa Finnih, senior health assistant to the governor of Lagos, said in an interview

[ex-khobar Andy]

Total thread hijack but to take up Rube's comment about JBS Haldane. He was one of the great evolutionary scientists of all time and long regarded, by those who knew him, as one of the most brilliant minds ever. He went to Eton - the famous English school as in William and Harry and Boris Johnson - OK they are not good examples - and was a committed communist for much of his life.

Rube you will enjoy an interview on You Tube. Richard Dawkins talking to John Maynard Smith who was one of Haldane's PhD students. JMS is widely regarded as one of the great exponents of evolutionary theory, especially putting it on a mathematical foundation. JMS's personal journey is a fascinating as Haldane's - also an Etonian, also a communist until Hungary, he became a biologist via aeronautical engineering. Some kind soul has broken this interview into around 100 pieces each two or three minutes. JMS talking about the death of Haldane from, as you mention, cancer, is especially moving. You can get to the whole playlist from here. I haven't watched them all.

[youtube]TZo4nxx4Ddw&list=PLVV0r6CmEsFzJSvAc4MBuUP_GrjO1lLHp&index=35&t=0s[/youtube]

(I don't know why that doesn't show up as a link in the normal way. Search for John Maynard Smith interview; see full playlist; it's 35/102.)

John Maynard Smith was the first real live professor I ever met - September 1967. In those days the title professor was very limited and there was one in each department. Nowadays just about every academic calls himself or herself a prof.