The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

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Darren
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Darren »

BoSoxGal wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:47 pm
Opening the economy won’t stop the deaths or the suicides related to the stress of living through a pandemic. I know you seem to think that opening the economy will get everything back to normal, but you’re stupid or naive to think that - normal isn’t coming back. We are going to see a million Americans die of a lethal virus over the next two years and because the only way to be safe from the virus is to stay home and get close to nobody, fear and depression will overwhelm many people.

It’s tiresome as fuck reading your moronic posts over and over pretending what is happening isn’t happening. You are Trump.


The race is between getting the knowledge to successfully treat people and the establishment of herd immunity against financial ruin not only for individuals and businesses but also states.

Not all states can go into debt to finance operations. Some like West Virginia are bound by their constitution to operate within their budgets. While pension fund debt is not included recent efforts have been made by the state and enforced on subdivisions of the state to fully fund pensions.

FWIW there is no home rule in WV other than those exceptions recently granted by the legislature.

Other states are faced with a large debt burden that can't be supported with the cutback in revenue collections. So what happens if a state goes bankrupt and like corporations is able to abandon their pension obligations?

How many pensioners will go from a middle class existence to poverty level?

Do we want to start that process and possibly set a legal precedent that would devastate millions?
Thank you RBG wherever you are!

Darren
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Darren »

Along with toilet, meat is not well stocked in the stores. This step supports the livestock farmers that supply the meat processing plants.

"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump plans to order U.S. meat processing plants facing concerns about coronavirus outbreaks to stay open to protect the country’s food supply, a senior administration official said on Tuesday."

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKCN22A2OB
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Econoline
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Econoline »

"We're gonna need a bigger wall."

58,276 dead in 20 years:
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59,110 dead (so far) in less than 3 months.
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Lord Jim
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

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"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump plans to order U.S. meat processing plants facing concerns about coronavirus outbreaks to stay open to protect the country’s food supply, a senior administration official said on Tuesday."
So he has no problem invoking the Defense Production Act to force people to risk their lives going back to work, but he can't bring himself to do it for the production of the reagents needed for testing, which would save lives...
:loon :loon :loon
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Darren
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Darren »

Lord Jim wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:53 am
"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump plans to order U.S. meat processing plants facing concerns about coronavirus outbreaks to stay open to protect the country’s food supply, a senior administration official said on Tuesday."
So he has no problem invoking the Defense Production Act to force people to risk their lives going back to work, but he can't bring himself to do it for the production of the reagents needed for testing, which would save lives...
:loon :loon :loon
You're not only off base, Jim, you're not even in the ball park. The CDC owns that and the three week delay it caused.
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Joe Guy
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Joe Guy »

Econoline wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:26 pm
.....59,110 dead (so far) in less than 3 months.
That's a lot of people who got sick of winning so much, Mr President.

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Lord Jim
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Lord Jim »

Darren wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 1:00 am
Lord Jim wrote:
Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:53 am
"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Donald Trump plans to order U.S. meat processing plants facing concerns about coronavirus outbreaks to stay open to protect the country’s food supply, a senior administration official said on Tuesday."
So he has no problem invoking the Defense Production Act to force people to risk their lives going back to work, but he can't bring himself to do it for the production of the reagents needed for testing, which would save lives...
:loon :loon :loon
You're not only off base, Jim, you're not even in the ball park. The CDC owns that and the three week delay it caused.
:roll:

So which was it that the CDC did Darren?

Invoke the Defense Production Act to order meat processing plants opened without any orders mandating new procedures for worker safety, or refuse to invoke the act to produce reagent chemicals for the testing kits?

I'm pretty sure that both of those decisions were all Trump...
Last edited by Lord Jim on Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Econoline
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Econoline »

You know the answer by now, Jim.

If it was a good decision, it was Trump. If it was a bad decision* it was somebody else, anybody else, someone in some part of the government over which Trump has no Total Authority, probably someone in some agency left over from Obama (or Clinton...)
LOOK!!! SQUIRREL!!!

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* a decision *NOT* to decide is still a decision.
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MajGenl.Meade
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by MajGenl.Meade »

Darren wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 7:11 pm
Along with toilet, meat is not well stocked in the stores.
Damn immigrants! Looting everywhere!

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Scooter
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Scooter »

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ex-khobar Andy
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by ex-khobar Andy »

My stimulus payments were credited a few days ago. Got my letter today personally signed in Sharpie (C). Let's see: if there are 100 million households in the US and a first class stamp costs the feds $0.40, that's $40,000,000 that could have gone to a better cause.

I sent a note to CNN's electronic Town Hall Q&A session on the stimulus payment when they announced it: essentially saying I'm OK for now so is there a way to say - put me to the back of the line so that money can go first to the neediest. I don't know if they used it but I bet there are a lot of people in our situation.

I'm pleased that some companies like Harvard and other big timers have seen fit to hand the money back: but what boggles my mind is that there is so little oversight that they managed to get a check in the first place. It reminds me a bit of the tobacco fund money which was supposed to go to education and health services. By some accounts 2.6% of the money went to tobacco prevention and cessation programs. Much of it went to prop up otherwise underfunded states' programs. But whenever there is a big pile of cash there are lots of people out there with shovels.

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Bicycle Bill
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Bicycle Bill »

ex-khobar Andy wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:08 pm
I'm pleased that some companies like Harvard and other big timers have seen fit to hand the money back: but what boggles my mind is that there is so little oversight that they managed to get a check in the first place. It reminds me a bit of the tobacco fund money which was supposed to go to education and health services. By some accounts 2.6% of the money went to tobacco prevention and cessation programs. Much of it went to prop up otherwise underfunded states' programs. But whenever there is a big pile of cash there are lots of people out there with shovels.
Would you care to guess how many of those companies like Harvard and other big-timers would have given that money back if they weren't being publicly pilloried for having applied for and gotten it in the first place?
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RayThom
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The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by RayThom »

ex-khobar Andy wrote:
Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:08 pm
... I sent a note to CNN's electronic Town Hall Q&A session on the stimulus payment when they announced it: essentially saying I'm OK for now so is there a way to say - put me to the back of the line so that money can go first to the neediest...
That's exactly as I feel, and I'm living on SS, my only source of income. As long as SS doesn't implode due to some kind of financial apocalypse my monthly income is guaranteed, as compared with over 16 million who are facing unemployment and lay-offs.

My personal hospital bills are now passing the $6000 mark. My stimulus payment is going toward that. So you know, Cigna/Medicare has paid out more than $478,000 to date and I still have the challenge of six months of chemo therapy (Capecitabine for starters) which is scheduled for next week.

Dying is easy, hospitalization is hard.
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Scooter
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

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California doctors with dubious COVID conclusions debunked

They dressed in scrubs. They sounded scientific. And last week’s message from two Bakersfield doctors was exactly what many stuck-at-home Americans wanted to hear: COVID-19 is no worse than influenza, its death rates are low and we should all go back to work and school.

Drs. Dan Erickson and Artin Massihi, who own urgent care centers in the region, had called a press conference to release their conclusions about the results of 5,213 COVID-19 tests they had conducted at their centers and testing site. They claimed the results showed that the virus had spread further in the area, undetected, and thus wasn’t all that dangerous.

But public health experts were quick to debunk the doctors’ findings as misguided and riddled with statistical errors — and an example of the kind of misleading information they are forced to waste precious time disputing.

The doctors should never have assumed that the patients they tested — who came for walk-in COVID-19 tests or who sought urgent care for symptoms they experienced in the middle of a pandemic — are representative of the general population, said Dr. Carl Bergstrom, a University of Washington biologist who specializes in infectious disease modeling. He likened their extrapolations to “estimating the average height of Americans from the players on an NBA court.” And most credible studies of COVID-19 death rates in reality are far higher than the ones the doctors presented.

“They’ve used methods that are ludicrous to get results that are completely implausible,” Bergstrom said.

Still, the early media coverage went viral. A local television report on the Bakersfield doctors’ press conference garnered more than 4.3 million views on YouTube. Elon Musk, the Tesla founder who wants to reopen his Fremont manufacturing plant this week, praised the doctors to his 33 million-plus Twitter followers. Last night, the doctors got a conservative national audience for their views on Fox News, appearing on Laura Ingraham’s show.

In a rare statement late today, the American College of Emergency Physicians and the American Academy of Emergency Medicine declared they “emphatically condemn the recent opinions released by Dr. Daniel Erickson and Dr. Artin Messihi. These reckless and untested musings do not speak for medical societies and are inconsistent with current science and epidemiology regarding COVID-19. As owners of local urgent care clinics, it appears these two individuals are releasing biased, non-peer reviewed data to advance their personal financial interests without regard for the public’s health.”

The doctors had set up Bakersfield’s only private walk-in COVID-19 testing site and performed about half of all tests conducted in the area. They did not respond to a CalMatters request for comment today.

Misinformation thrives in a pandemic, and public health officials in California and elsewhere just can’t keep up.

“This pandemic has been so severely politicized in this country that evidence, no matter how poor, gets amplified enormously if it benefits one side or another,” said Bergstrom, who also was one of the first experts to critique the doctors’ study on Twitter. “We always hoped this crisis wouldn’t come, but that if it did we’d all be in this together. That’s been a huge surprise for all of us doing infectious disease epidemiology. It’s amazing to have to deal with this misinformation that’s being spread around for political purposes and the ways that interferes with adequate public health response.”

California Democratic state Sen. Richard Pan, a pediatrician who chairs the Senate Health Committee, said lawmakers who favor reopening the state had not yet cited the Bakersfield doctors’ conclusions as a justification to do so. But if they did, they’d “be on pretty weak ground,” he said.

The doctors “basically hyped a bunch of data and weren’t transparent about their methods. And they really played on the fact that they’re physicians. I think it’s quite disingenuous of them.” Pan said. “Then we have to push back on any media that promotes this information. They’re really doing this as a way to fish for attention.”

A Kern County public health spokeswoman told reporters that officials did not support the doctors’ call to reopen the region. Other epidemiologists echoed that sentiment.

But already the Bakersfield doctors — who tout their support of President Donald Trump and refuse to wear masks in public — had become heroes on social platforms and conservative media outlets, with some commenters calling them “brave.” Others who support continuing to shelter-in-place described the doctors as self-promoters whose chain of urgent care centers would benefit from reopening. Non-COVID medical visits have plummeted during the pandemic, endangering the practices of many doctors.

“As struggling business owners, their economic frustration is understandable. But it can’t be mistaken for science. People trust doctors,” Michigan emergency room doctor Rob Davidson wrote on Twitter. “When they tell Fox viewers to ignore recommendations from real experts, many will believe them…The impact of rejecting science-proven recommendations in exchange for these erroneous ideas would overwhelm health systems and cost lives. While re-opening the economy might be good for their Urgent Care Centers (sic), it would kill medical personnel on the actual front lines.”
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Lord Jim
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Lord Jim »

Tucker Carlson in particular really tried to pump up and give legitimacy to these two unscrupulous quacks...

Tucker is really starting to earn himself a special place in hell; he's making himself an accessory to mass murder...
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Econoline
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Econoline »

BILL KRISTOL???!!?!?

:? How crazy has the world gotten, that I'm agreeing with BILL FUCKING KRISTOL?

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Econoline
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Econoline »

Darren wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 12:24 am
May 1, 2020
People who are wrong are just as sure they're right as people who are right. The only difference is, they're wrong.
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Lord Jim
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Lord Jim »

BILL KRISTOL???!!?!?

:? How crazy has the world gotten, that I'm agreeing with BILL FUCKING KRISTOL?
Econo if you go back and check the record, I think you'll ind that you've been agreeing with Bill Kristol for longer than you know... ;)

Bill has been a very public leading activist among Republican/Conservative Never Trumpers, going back to long I Boobce became the nominee in 2016.
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dales
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by dales »

Econoline wrote:
Fri May 01, 2020 10:05 pm
Darren wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 12:24 am
May 1, 2020
More commie nonsense! :lol:

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
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Scooter
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Re: The Countdown to the restart of the economy has begun.

Post by Scooter »

AS GERMANY EASES LOCKDOWN RESTRICTIONS, CORONAVIRUS INFECTION RATE RISES

After Germany declared the coronavirus pandemic "under control" and moved to ease lockdown restrictions, the European country's infection rate has now risen.

Earlier this month, Germany's Health Minister Jens Spahn said that the outbreak was "under control" and some stringent social distancing measures have been eased over the past few days. Some shops have been allowed to reopen and some students have returned to school for the first time in weeks. Other large businesses, such as the car manufacturer Volkswagen, have resumed some production.


But data reported late on Monday showed that the infection rate in the country has now risen to 1.0, up from 0.9, German broadcaster Deutsche Welle reported. The infection rate had been hovering around 0.7 in mid-April. Germany's Chancellor Angela Merkel has previously warmed that an infection rate of 1.1 could overwhelm the country's health care system within months.

"Even if we assume that one person infects 1.1 others, we would reach the limits of what our health system and intensive care beds can manage in October," Merkel, who was trained as a scientist before entering politics, explained earlier in April.

"If we assume a rate of 1.2 ... we would reach the health system's limit in July. And with a rate of 1.3 - it doesn't sound like much - we would get there in June already," the chancellor added.

The infection rate signifies the average number of people infected after one person catches the novel coronavirus. When the infection rate stands at 1.0, that means each infected person infects an average of one other person. Social distancing measures helped Germany lower its infection rate substantially while flattening it's overall curve of new infections. But as more people begin to venture out, there is concern that the outbreak could again worsen.

"We do not want to have more COVID-19 cases again," Lothar Wieler, president of the Robert Koch Institute (RKI) for disease control, said Tuesday in Berlin, The Local reported. RKI released the data showing that the infection rate had risen 1.0.

"Let us continue to stay at home as much as possible, keep observing the restrictions and keep a distance of 1.5 meters (4.9 feet) from one another," Wieler urged the German public.

"We all need to take care that we don't end up with more infections," he added, noting that the European county's handling of the crisis had thus far been viewed as a "success" which should be "defended."

As of Tuesday, Germany had confirmed that more than 158,000 people had been infected with the coronavirus, according to a tracker updated by Johns Hopkins University. Of those infected, 6,126 had died while over 114,000 have already recovered.
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