When will 'too much' be 'enough'?

[ex-khobar Andy]

Another school shooting, of course. And everyone in Georgia's political firmament is praying, it seems. Governor Brian Kemp and Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger - who both seem to be good guys in the context of GA elections - among many others.

I have nothing against prayers. They can't hurt and they may even help individuals to atone or feel safer or whatever. But for crying out loud (I nearly said 'for christ's sake!') let's look for a more practical solution. Easy access to weapons. It seems that the alleged shooter "was questioned by law enforcement last year regarding “several anonymous tips about online threats to commit a school shooting at an unidentified location and time,” according to a joint statement from FBI Atlanta and the Jackson County Sheriff’s Office." per CNN. Certainly it's a failure of law enforcement if he made those threats and still had access to weapons. It may be that Georgia law is such that unless a threat is proven they cannot restrict 2nd amendment 'rights.'

I said above that prayers can't hurt. Re-reading what I wrote I have second thoughts about that sentence. If anyone think that this is a substitute for, or even a practical component of, effective action then prayers more than hurt: they are complicit in the action they apparently deprecate.

I keep hearing 'enough is enough.' I think we passed 'enough' long, long ago.

[Burning Petard]

I remember one piece of guidance in my pastoral training: Always start with prayer. But don't stop there.

snailgate.

[BoSoxGal]

A couple of thoughts:

Georgia has some of the least restrictive gun regulations in the nation. It is not unlawful to leave loaded firearms, or firearms and ammunition, unlocked and accessible to children. This is unconscionable. Every state should have laws requiring safe storage, the large majority of Americans and gun owners alike want laws like this.

We all know there is a mental health crisis in this country, yet somehow the funds never appear to make meaningful progress in beefing up mental health services. We all know that this mental health crisis is affecting our children most of all, yet schools that can barely afford to fully staff - and in some cases just can't - in the absence of the covid funds that have dried up, are certainly in no position to increase staffing in the counseling office.

We all know access to firearms in too many states is far too easy for kids to achieve thanks to shitty gun laws.

But Georgia is definitely going to be charging this shooter as an adult - as an adult at FOURTEEN years old. Because vengeance! (is mine, saith the Lord).

It's all so sick. We, the adults, are responsible for this crisis. We, the adults, have failed our children for a quarter century since Columbine should have compelled us to tackle both mental health and gun control. But rather than taking responsibility for our failures, we are just going to keep chucking broken children into the adult penal system and call it good.

[ex-khobar Andy]

From today's NYT:

About 400 people gathered at a candlelight vigil just before sunset in Winder's Jug Tavern Park. Two local officials spoke briefly, followed by a sermon from Geoffrey Murphy, the senior pastor of Winder First United Methodist Church, and a moment of silence.

FFS. This reminds me of that canard: "There are no atheists in a foxhole." Sure: I have never been in a foxhole, so this is of course speculation. But I am pretty certain that if I am ever trapped in a ditch, and people all around are shooting at me, my first thought will not be "There must be a God after all!"

[Big RR]

BSG--while I also hate to see young kids tried as a dults, I do think we need significant changes to our juvenile justice system to avoid this. From what I read, this kid would be subject in GA to a sentence of 1 year max if tried as a juvenile; so 1 year later he is back out. Even if there were good mental health care avaialble (and generally there is not), I seriously doubt 1 year is sufficient time to address the serious problems this kid has--so all the system can do is keep him off the streets and out of the schools for a while. You have a lot more experience in criminal law than I do, so perhaps there are alternatives, but I seriously doubt there are any good ones. We need to look again at our juvenile justice system and discuss what we need to do, but given the way things are going I doubt that will ever come in my lifetime.

[Scooter]

[Sue U]

Sorry, but this is not a mental health issue or a juvenile justice issue (although both certainly could use fixing); this is a gun issue.

Too many guns
Too readily available
To too many people

Every one of those elements has to be addressed in a meaningful way if there's ever going to be change. And they won't be, because guns are viewed as a political issue rather than a public health and safety issue. The NRA and gun manufacturers have made sure of that and the GOP knows they'll pay and propagandize.

If we as a country weren't willing to do anything after Sandy Hook, or Las Vegas, or Pulse, or Uvalde, or any of the other numerous incidents of mass slaughter, then we will never do anything, because this is a sick society kept that way for power and profit.

[Burning Petard]

Yess Big RR, this is a justice issue There is no consensus about what is supposed to happen to the incarcerated while the are in (beyond make them uncomfortable and do it cheap). EVERY ONE OF THEM is going back on the street, unless we are willing to keep them in cages until they die. Very little money is expended to find a way that will make them productive, contributing to the greater good when they are released.

snailgate.

[Big RR]

Sue--yes, guns are the primary issue in these mass shootings; but another issue brought up by BSG, one that is bigger than the shootings alone, is the juvenile justice system and what do we do with juveniles who commit violent crimes. When I worked for DYFS I had a client (14) who violently raped his 12 year old sister; he insisted he did nothing , but he was found guilty on good evidence (I didn't do the criminal trial, but saw the violence and talked to the DA) and sentenced to the longest incarceration he could get as a juvenile, 1 year. I was working with DYFS to see what could be done after he left the facility (the family court enjoined him from going home while his sister was there, but after 1 year he still insisted he did nothing wrong (honestly, his family had a lot of problems themselves and were among the northwest Jersey hillbillies, which may be the main reason why he thought he did nothing wrong). It was pretty frustrating--he needed some therapy (and it was ordered by the family court), but insisting he did nothing wrong wasn't helping). We got him in an all male school and parental rights were terminated; unfortunately, my involvement ended there; however, if it occurred to me, if he had raped a girl in the neighborhood instead of his sister, he would have gone home to his parents and, likely, no more therapy--I imagine he night even be back in an adult jail for the same offense. This is something we need to deal with as well. How do we deal with violent juvenile offenders--because, even without guns, they can wreak a lot of havoc.

[Scooter]