The Empire Strikes Back

[liberty]

The Empire Strikes Back; the left finally got around to a retaliation against law and order, "We don't need no stinking law and order. What we need is more drug users, more unprovoked assaults, more Karens raped". It's a matter of national pride; a nation's capital should be so safe that a beautiful woman could walk naked down the middle of any street after midnight with a necklace of $1000 bills around her neck anywhere in the city and no one would dare touch her. Of course, I realize that's not realistic that's only a sentiment on my part, but the capital should have the lowest crime rate in the country!


https://abcnews.go.com/US/national-guar ... =127912861
Two National Guardsmen were ambushed Wednesday in the nation's capital in what officials are calling a targeted shooting."

The suspected gunman has been identified by law enforcement as 29-year-old Rahmanullah Lakanwal. He will be charged with three counts of assault with the intent to kill while armed and criminal possession of a weapon, officials said during a press conference on Thursday.

"You picked the wrong target, the wrong city and the wrong country and you will be sorry for the violence and the evil you perpetrated in our nation's capital," Jeanine Pirro, U.S. attorney for the District of Columbia, told reporters.

[liberty]

I find it interesting that the shooter came from Washington State, an ultra-leftist region in the northwest of the state. Some parts of the state are so far to the left that they're almost anti-American. That is, of course, my opinion. I have no way to verify it, but that's the impression I get.

[Big RR]

It's a matter of national pride; a nation's capital should be so safe that a beautiful woman could walk naked down the middle of any street after midnight with a necklace of $1000 bills around her neck anywhere in the city and no one would dare touch her.

that is perhaps one of the most asinine things you have ever said.

How about, the national capital, hell anywhere in the US, should be a place where a person could walk down the street without having to show his or her papers. That's the kind of America I want, not an armed camp patrolled by the military.

[liberty]

It's a matter of national pride; a nation's capital should be so safe that a beautiful woman could walk naked down the middle of any street after midnight with a necklace of $1000 bills around her neck anywhere in the city and no one would dare touch her.

that is perhaps one of the most asinine things you have ever said.

How about, the national capital, hell anywhere in the US, should be a place where a person could walk down the street without having to show his or her papers. That's the kind of America I want, not an armed camp patrolled by the military.

It did not escape my attention that you were selective about my statement. As I said, I realize it was not a realistic expression of fact—just a cinematic example. However, it appears that to you, rape, murder, and robbery are signs of freedom. I am willing to make sacrifices for freedom, but I don’t see why visible thuggish street crime has to be one of them. It appears that the situation is that some places in this country are going to be armed camps. The only question is who will be in control—the thugs or the government.

Sure, when people have a great degree of freedom, there will always be those who abuse it. I believe we should do everything in our power to control those people. However, somethings will inevitably be beyond our ability, and we’ll just have to endure them if we truly value freedom.

That said, I don’t see the big deal with showing your papers. I’ve never had a problem showing a police officer my driver’s license, and I wouldn’t have a problem showing him my citizenship card as well if we had such a thing.

[MajGenl.Meade]

I find it interesting that the shooter came from Washington State, an ultra-leftist region in the northwest of the state. Some parts of the state are so far to the left that they're almost anti-American. That is, of course, my opinion. I have no way to verify it, but that's the impression I get.

I must disagree Big RR - above is the most etc. etc. We have some Afghan who worked for the CIA and he's an ultra-leftist liberal because he drove from Washington. A more likely (though speculative) guess is that the Trump wing of the Gestapo refused to allow a member of his family to escape the Taliban when they decided to disallow US-supporting Afghans the promised haven in the land of the Truly Free.

[Big RR]

I think you're disagreeing with Liberty, not me.

[Big RR]

That said, I don’t see the big deal with showing your papers. I’ve never had a problem showing a police officer my driver’s license, and I wouldn’t have a problem showing him my citizenship card as well if we had such a thing.

I haven't had a problem with showing my license during a traffic stop, but then driving is a privilege and if you choose to drive you agree to that. But walking down the street is a right and I do not agree to showing some proof of citizenship or account for what I am doing. And while I am all for safe streets, having the military to patrol them is going too far, but then I do value freedom.

[Joe Guy]

I think you're disagreeing with Liberty, not me.

I think Meade was saying that he had found something asininer (should be a word) that liberty had written.

[MajGenl.Meade]

I think you're disagreeing with Liberty, not me.

I think Meade was saying that he had found something asininer (should be a word) that liberty had written.

[Bicycle Bill]

That said, I don’t see the big deal with showing your papers. I’ve never had a problem showing a police officer my driver’s license, and I wouldn’t have a problem showing him my citizenship card as well if we had such a thing.

And when they tell you to wear a yellow star or a pink triangle or whatever symbol they want to use to designate just which pigeonhole you belong in, you'll meekly pin one of those on yourself too, I suppose.

-"BB"-

[Burning Petard]

I am very curious about the people who seem to be so certain about the actions that must follow true love of their country, the USofA. I go to meetings of the American Legion where we begin meeting by reciting the pledge of AllegianceI, and the preamble to the constitution of the American Legion, where we promise, among other things, to promote 100% Americanism. I proudly were a badge on my hat (The hat is the only official item of the Am Legion uniform) indicating that I passed the basic training course for the American Legion. During the course I carefully watched to instruction on just what '100% Americanism' means, On this topic it was very carefully full of undefined pretty phrases.

I note the last word of the pledge of allegiance to the flag. . . is ALL.

Seems to me, just my non-objetive opinion, that the people who talk the most about this stuff always want to put exclusions and exceptions on that liberty and justice for all.

snailgate,

[Big RR]

I think Meade was saying that he had found something asininer (should be a word) that liberty had written.

Oh, OK then. In the immortal words of Emily Litella, Never Mind.

[Burning Petard]

A fine group of upstanding white Christian Americans in Oklahoma City on 19 April 11995 killed 167 people, injured 684 and destroyed $652 million in real estate. Tell me more about these dangerous immigrants the Trump administration granted asylum in April of this year.

At the same time the flood of dangerous drugs continues to come across from Mexico, in spite of Trumps beautiful wall and closed border. But the US Navy (without even flying the Jolly Roger) kills Venezuelan boatmen in international waters because they may be part of a dripping faucet of the nasty drugs.

The current administration needs to change the seal to the Jolly Roger, with the motto: Oh Look! There's a squirrel

snailgate

[Scooter]

The same questions that Jim Wright asks in this piece should be applied to the war that Trump is waging in the streets of the U.S.

During Vietnam, the Army reported the daily body count up the chain of command. 50 Vietcong killed. 200 North Vietnamese soldiers killed. The army would report it to the Pentagon and the bean counters would report it to the Joint Chiefs and the Generals would report it to the President and Nixon would report it to the Press. Every night, my dad would have the news on at the dinner table and we'd hear 50 Vietcong killed, 200 North Vietnamese, whatever the count was. Good! We got 'em!
Except...
Except, what was the objective? What was the plan? How did those dead bodies further those goals and move us closer to the end point? To victory? To the defeat of Communism? To keep the dominoes from falling?
No one ever told you that.
Just, LOOK! Dead commies! Good! We got 'em. Yeah. That HAD to be good, right? And yet, all those dead bodies, all those body counts, every day at dinner, and yet, somehow, we lost. Or at least we didn't win.
58,000 dead Americans, for what? No one knows.
It sure didn't stop Communism. We left. Gave up, whatever you want to call it. 58,000 dead Americans, God know how many Vietnamese. Vietnam become communist anyway. Nowadays, they're STILL communist, and for some reason they make all of our underwear. We're capitalists and we just plain hate communism, but goddamn does capitalism love that cheap communist labor. Boy howdy.
We could have stayed out of Vietnam, saved 58,000 American lives, and gotten cheap underwear 20 years earlier.
A few decades later and it's the War on Terrorism.
Yeah, you remember. The War on Terrorism. Again, 20 years of war. Thousands more dead American soldiers, hundreds of thousands dead Iraqis and Afghans. Every day, they'd report the victories up the chain of command. The Colonels told the Generals, the Generals told the President, the President told the Press, the Press told America, street by street, door by door, body by body, we're winning!
And yet, somehow, we STILL have terrorism.
They never told you what the objective of the war was. What was the plan again? What's the objective? No terrorism? Some terrorism? A little terrorism? What's victory look like? How do you measure it? How do you know when you've won?
They never answered ANY of those questions. No one ever asked. Not the politicians. Not the press. Not the military. Not voters. No one.
Again, after 20 years of war, we just sort of gave up. Is the world a better place for it? Is it? Did we defeat terrorism?
Now, still, it's the Forever War on drugs. War on narcoterrorism, whatever that is. Been going on since Nixon.
Every day, the Navy reports the body count up the chain of command. Blew up some boats. Killed some narcoterrorists. And the Admirals tell the Generals and the Generals tell the President and Trump tells the Press and the Press tells us: Blew up some boats! Killed some druggies! And America nods over dinner, well, all right! We got 'em! We're winning! Yay!
Except...
We bombed some boats. We Killed some people. Captured some drugs. But what's the OBJECTIVE? What are the measurables? How many boats do you have to blow up, how many traffickers to you have to kill, how many tons of drugs do you have to capture, to win?
What IS winning?
Are there less drug users? How do you know? Has the price of illicit drugs gone up on the street? How do you KNOW you're having any affect? That's not a rhetorical question. How do you know? How do you measure victory?
I joined the military not long after Vietnam ended, years later I fought in Iraq, and then spent the last part of my career hunting drug traffickers in South American waters. In between, among other assignments, I was a war planner. I wrote warfighting doctrine. It all starts with the objectives. You map out the measurables, the quantitative and qualitative metrics that determine how you meet the objectives. That determines the strategy and tactics and what victory looks like.
That's what makes us different from our enemies. That planning. That clear focus on objectives, where measurables drive tactics, where victory is clearly defined...
What?
Heh heh, well, okay, you got me. That's how it's supposed to be. When we stick to it, we win. When we forget it, we lose.
Q.E.D.
We won nearly every battle in Vietnam, but lost the war. We won nearly every battle in Iraq and Afghanistan, but lost the peace. We win every engagement with the "narcoterrorists" but there aren't any fewer drugs.
Because we never defined victory. We don't even know what it looks like. We've never talked about it. Trump sure as hell doesn't know. The military doesn't know. Corporate America doesn't know but goddamn are they ready to make a profit on whatever happens in the meantime. You, American Voter, you don't know and you've never even thought about it.
Our wholes lives, with a few momentary exceptions, we've been at war.
We don't know why. We don't even know what victory looks like.
We never asked.
And here we go again. We bombed some boats, we killed some people, the Admirals tell the Generals the Generals tell the President the President brags to the Press and the Press tells us and NO WHERE in that entire process does anyone stop and ask: what the hell are we doing? What's the objective? What's victory look like? How do we measure it? How do we know when we've won? Is this a war we even want to fight?
Is there a better way?
Back during Vietnam, the children of rich cowards, Trump himself, avoided service while others went to fight and die in a war started by greedy selfish violent men all too willing to sacrifice other peoples' children. Business grew rich. And we paid and we're still paying.
But we never saw victory.
Round and round the cycle goes.
And here we are again. Are we going to spend another 20 years in the jungle just to give up with nothing to show for it but another generation of dead Americans -- all while Trump grows even richer?
What's the GOAL?
What does Trump expect to achieve by attacking Venezuela? No more drugs? An end to terrorism? A regime change? Peace in our time? What?
These are the questions CONGRESS must ask right now.
These are the questions THE PRESS must ask right now.
These are the answers AMERICANS must demand of their elected leaders and get those answers or throw the bastards from office right now.
It's your goddamn kids who are going to have to fight Trump's war. You want a better world for them, be a better citizen.

[liberty]

The war on drugs is finally what it should have been all along: a real war on drugs. In the past, it was treated like a joke, but now it is no longer a joke. Those who import illicit drugs into the United States are enemies of the nation. They are killing and enslaving Americans.

If you support drug dealers, you support slavery. Addiction is not freedom, it is bondage. The addict is a slave to the supplier, a submissive servant who will do whatever it takes to keep that supplier satisfied. Up to 80% of people who attempt to break free from addiction fail and are dragged back into a life of submission. Supporting drug dealers means supporting this cycle of slavery.

I see nothing wrong with targeting transoceanic drug shipments. What legitimate cargo could possibly justify the expense of a souped‑up “go‑fast” boat capable of traveling 80 miles an hour, equipped with extra fuel tanks and rotating crews for nonstop trips? None that I can imagine. It is obvious to anyone with intelligence that these are drug shipments. And if the enemy is clinging to floating bales of drugs, they had better get away from them, because there is nothing wrong with attacking those targets.

[Scooter]

That last bit there is called "giving no quarter" and it is a war crime. Someone who claims to have been in the military should know that.

[Joe Guy]

The war on drugs is finally what it should have been all along: a real war on drugs. In the past, it was treated like a joke, but now it is no longer a joke. Those who import illicit drugs into the United States are enemies of the nation. They are killing and enslaving Americans.

I disagree with the idea that people who bring drugs into the US are killing and enslaving Americans. People who buy illegal drugs take their chances. They know the risks. If they weren't buying imported drugs, they'd be buying drugs from inside the US. As the imports decrease, the domestic products will increase. The only thing likely to be affected is the price of those drugs. But Trump will get one result that he has promised - more manufacturing in the US.

If you support drug dealers, you support slavery. Addiction is not freedom, it is bondage.....

That's ridiculous. The only people who support drug dealers are the people who buy their drugs. Nobody is forcing people to use them.

I see nothing wrong with targeting transoceanic drug shipments.

Why kill them? Do you not believe in due process?

[BoSoxGal]

Along the lines of what Joe Guy said above;

Contrary to the recreational drugs users who chose to try drugs out and some got very addicted are all the good folks who never intended to try drugs but were pushed highly addictive opiates by their own physicians in whom they trusted - then many became addicted and many of those people died, including far too many kids who were pushed opiates for wisdom tooth removal or a fractured ankle.

Why didn’t the US government drop missiles from drones on the headquarters of Purdue Pharma? And the homes of the sick profiteering Sacklers who manslaughtered hundreds of thousands of American men women and children by intentionally addicting them to prescription opiates for profits???

If we are going to commit some war crimes, let’s blow up some of the biggest war criminals and not some boat drivers from the developing world.