What Value Education?

All things philosophical, related to belief and / or religions of any and all sorts.
Personal philosophy welcomed.
rubato
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by rubato »

dales wrote:
Thiel Foundation fellowships have scary premise
James Temple, Chronicle Columnist

Sunday, May 29, 2011

On Wednesday, the Thiel Foundation named the first winners of its controversial "20 Under 20" fellowship program, a sort of anti-college scholarship in which young people are handed $100,000 to pursue entrepreneurial ideas rather than a university education.

It's a limited program designed to showcase a bigger - and troubling - idea: that higher education is highly overvalued.

The Thiel Foundation, the libertarian group formed by PayPal co-founder and early Facebook investor Peter Thiel, has been spreading the message for months, telling any outlet that will listen that college is a waste of a lot of people's time and money. It's a "higher education bubble" - and we all know how dangerous those are.

The 24 fellows (they couldn't settle on just 20), ranging from 17 to 20 years old, will be given $100,000 cash grants to purse scientific or technological ideas over the next two years, in areas like space exploration, clean energy, education and robotics.

The broad aim of "20 under 20" is to produce more technological innovation, and in turn faster and more sustainable economic growth, said James O'Neill, head of the Thiel Foundation. That's best achieved by unleashing the creative and unsullied mind power of young people, before lofty student loans and academic orthodoxy funnel them into safe and risk-adverse careers, he said.

"We're not saying that college or graduate school is wrong for everyone," he said. "But for entrepreneurship, for innovation in fields like computers or the Internet ... there's a combination of skills and drive that typically (isn't) very effectively taught in colleges or graduate school, where real world experience is probably the best teacher."

Limited exceptions
For a limited number of incredibly smart, self-motivated people in these fields, this is all difficult to argue with. Indeed, there's little worry that the whip smart eager beavers who won the fellowships are going to be ruined by forgoing or postponing college.

But the concern lies with the broader message, which O'Neill articulates this way: "It would be good for people to think very carefully about the costs and benefits of college, before they decide whether and when and where to go to college. We don't think that college is the best answer for every smart kid."
This is just highly subsidized education by a different name. OK, they don't the the substantial benefits of a faculty as eminent as a UC school and $100,000 is FAR less than what a private University would cost (ca $50,000/yr) and more than a UC. 24 people? A tiny experiment, I'm for it, but its tiny.

yrs,
rubato

rubato
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by rubato »

The ability to pay for a better education for the next and following generations is not some horrible burden to be shirked and whined about but one of the primary blessings of living in an affluent society.

History has shown conclusively that the most powerful means of making the future better than the past is by investing in education.

The question is not "how little can we get away with" but "how much can we scrape together".

If you want a world that is as nasty as the "Red States" are today then spend as little as you can and let ignorance and native meanness and evil take their course.

yrs,
rubato

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dales
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by dales »

This is just highly subsidized education by a different name. OK, they don't the the substantial benefits of a faculty as eminent as a UC school and $100,000 is FAR less than what a private University would cost (ca $50,000/yr) and more than a UC. 24 people? A tiny experiment, I'm for it, but its tiny.

yrs,
rubato
Agreed.

Not everyone should go to college, at least obtain a "cerificate of training" from a Community College.

With only a HS diploma, there's virtually nothing out there as far as opportunties or rewarding careers.

One of my daughters is working her way through college at a snail's pace (she works two jobs) my niece will graduate from Fresno State soon, and my nephew will be starting music at UOP in August.

My other nephew (23 years old) works as a waiter......he was never interested in school. However, I believe that waiting on tables will grow old and the boy will develop another skill set.

I have an MA in Transpersonal Psychology and will soon enter into the field of helping others.

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

rubato
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by rubato »

Please, please tell me you didn't go to the Institute for Transpersonal Psychology ( http://www.itp.edu/ ). You didn't, did you?


yrs,
rubato

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dales
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by dales »

No, I went here..................http://www.jfku.edu/

Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.


yrs,
rubato

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Lord Jim
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by Lord Jim »

Transpersonal Psychology
I confess I had to look that one up Dale....
Transpersonal psychology developed from earlier schools of psychology including psychoanalysis, behaviorism, and humanistic psychology. Transpersonal psychology attempts to describe and integrate spiritual experience within modern psychological theory and to formulate new theory to encompass such experience. Types of spiritual experience examined vary greatly but include mysticism, religious conversion, altered states of consciousness, trance and spiritual practices.
So are you planning to hang out a shingle in Berkley, or are you looking for office space in Marin?

:D
ImageImageImage

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Guinevere
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by Guinevere »

“I must study politics and war, that my sons may have the liberty to study mathematics and philosophy, natural history and naval architecture, in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, tapestry, and porcelain.”

~~John Adams

"Wisdom, and knowledge, as well as virtue, diffused generally among the body of the people, being necessary for the preservation of their rights and liberties; and as these depend on spreading the opportunities and advantages of education in the various parts of the country, and among the different orders of the people, it shall be the duty of legislatures and magistrates, in all future periods of this commonwealth, to cherish the interests of literature and the sciences, and all seminaries of them; especially the university at Cambridge, public schools and grammar schools in the towns; to encourage private societies and public institutions, rewards and immunities, for the promotion of agriculture, arts, sciences, commerce, trades, manufactures, and a natural history of the country; to countenance and inculcate the principles of humanity and general benevolence, public and private charity, industry and frugality, honesty and punctuality in their dealings; sincerity, good humor, and all social affections, and generous sentiments among the people."

Massachusetts Constitution, Part II, c. V. (also authored by John Adams)

He got it absolutely right, in 1780. Nothing in the interceding 230 years has occurred to make what he said less true. In fact, if anything, education is more important than ever.
“I ask no favor for my sex. All I ask of our brethren is that they take their feet off our necks.” ~ Ruth Bader Ginsburg, paraphrasing Sarah Moore Grimké

dgs49
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by dgs49 »

In 1930, a HS education included math up to calculus, Latin, the Classics, and a good background in history and civics. Only 25% of the population achieved a HS diploma, and it was much desired and respected.

One could well ask whether today's "BA" college grads are as well educated as our parents and grandparents who never went to college. Neither money nor time constitute education; we spend a ton of both today with little to show for it.

There is no doubt that some "worthless" college classes provide a type of intellectual stimulation that one simply does not get anywhere else, and it is questionable whether intelligent critical thinking can be self-taught (i.e., outside a college classroom). We all know many doctors and engineers whose understanding of politicics, philosophy, theology, etc., is primitive beyond belief.

Still, this does not justify the horrible financial waste that goes on today in America's college campuses.

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Gob
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by Gob »

I have to agree with dgs (urrgh... I feel all icky now.)

When I did my first degree something like 5-6% of the population of the UK reached that level. Now it is over 50%. No one is going to tell me that standards have not been allowed to slip to achieve this.
The chief inspector of schools in England, Chris Woodhead has accused universities of devaluing higher education by offering "quasi-academic degrees".

Madonna Studies, golf course management, pig enterprise management, knitwear and beauty therapy courses were cited as examples of degree courses that add little or nothing to students' employment prospects.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”

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Sean
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by Sean »

The chief inspector of schools in England, Chris Woodhead has accused universities of devaluing higher education by offering "quasi-academic degrees".

Madonna Studies, golf course management, pig enterprise management, knitwear and beauty therapy courses were cited as examples of degree courses that add little or nothing to students' employment prospects.
He's talking out of his arse! Not only that but I could set him straight.. Me and my degree in 'Debating with Chief Inspectors Called Chris' would sort him out...

:lol:
Why is it that when Miley Cyrus gets naked and licks a hammer it's 'art' and 'edgy' but when I do it I'm 'drunk' and 'banned from the hardware store'?

oldr_n_wsr
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Re: What Value Education?

Post by oldr_n_wsr »

pig enterprise management
My fathers cousin (my second cousin?) has a pig farm in Germany. Multimillionaire he is. Don't know what degree he has, but don'r diss pig management.

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