Santorum: Smart people aren't with us. Cantor shows why.

[Scooter]

Tell it to Romney, who thinks they can never be taught to take personal responsibility and care for their lives.

[oldr_n_wsr]

Tell it to Romney, who thinks they can never be taught to take personal responsibility and care for their lives.

I don't see (heard) where he ever said that. I think he wants people to take responsibility for their lives. To get off of gov assistance. I don't see the problem with that.

Don't know who has the hand up program but it MUST be there.

Now it may be an anti Obama message, but I heard that Obama took the work part out of Clintons "work"-fare program. If that is so, maybe it's Obama making people dependant.

I know that when I was collecting unemployment insurance, I would have taken any job they wanted me to do while collecting the money. Just to get my ass out of the house and do something. There are too many hours in teh day sitting around. Pick up garbage on teh side of the road, clean out the animal cages at the ecology center, anything.

[Scooter]

He says that those who do not pay federal income taxes will never vote for him, does he not?
He says he will never be able to convince them to take personal responsibility for their lives, does he not?
Soldiers serving in combat zones are one of the groups of people that do not pay federal income tax, are they not?
Therefore soldiers serving in combat are among those he claims will never vote for him and can never be convinced to take personal responsibility for their lives.

Oh wait, you say, surely he NEVER intended to include soldiers who are risking their lives for their country in those statements! Well, that's the problem with speaking in such gross generalities and painting everyone with the same brush. Just as soldiers serving in combat don't fit the picture he painted, there are just as surely MANY, MANY others who do not fit the stereotype he put forward and don't deserve to be slimed by this silver spooner who never had to learn the value of a dollar.

[oldr_n_wsr]

He says that those who do not pay federal income taxes will never vote for him, does he not?

He may have infered that but if that includes those who earn all their income from long term capital gains, then I say he is wrong. Those who do get their income through long term captial gains (aka no income or taxes) will vote for him.

He says he will never be able to convince them to take personal responsibility for their lives, does he not?

i did not hear that statement. It might be implied, but by who?

Soldiers serving in combat zones are one of the groups of people that do not pay federal income tax, are they not?

I can assure you that a blanket statement, made by either candidate, is subject to scrutiny as is this one. One can deduce a million different things from any statement. To take any one statement to it's assumed conclusion results in a million different assumed conclusions.

If true and half of Americans do not pay federal income tax (meaning they made wages subject to federal income tax even discounting those in the military which I am more than happy to make up their percentage) there are those who are not paying their share. Redo the code so those that should be paying have to do so. Extending the tax cuts that exist, may be a good start, but I believe the problem is deeper than that. And if deeper it has not been addressed at all during the last four years.

[Guinevere]

1. The bit about not taking personal responsibility is a direct quote. Read the transcript of Mittens' remarks.

2. You realize more tax cuts mean more people *off* the tax rolls, right?

3. How does increasing tax cuts effectuate your goal of having more people pay their fair share?

4. Do the Republicans have any solutions *other* than tax cuts?

[Gob]

Another prime example of how the US overcomplicates everything?

This is the UK income tax structure.

[Scooter]

Somehow I doubt it is that simple. It even says, "Calculations assume no other allowances or deductions". I'm sure the UK tax code has all sorts of provisions that increase/decrease tax beyond that simplistic table.

[Gob]

Everyone who has an earned income in the UK pays income tax.

[Gob]

I don't see (heard) where he ever said that. I think he wants people to take responsibility for their lives. To get off of gov assistance. I don't see the problem with that.

[Scooter]

Everyone who has an earned income in the UK pays income tax.

Since the UK has a Personal Allowance, a [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_tax_credit]Working Tax Credit, and a Child Tax Credit, that cannot be. I suspect there are other deductions that will further reduce the amount of tax payable.

[Andrew D]

Now it may be an anti Obama message, but I heard that Obama took the work part out of Clintons "work"-fare program.

That is just another of the Romney/Ryan campaign's lies:

PolitiFact checked a Romney campaign ad's claim that Obama ended welfare work requirements earlier this month, rating it Pants On Fire. ... FactCheck.org and the Washington Post Fact Checker have also said the claim is false.

Hardly surprising.

[liberty]

We will never have the elite, smart people on our side.

Oh my...

Of course Mr. Santorum (and Mrs. Santorum) are both "elite smart people"....

Though you certainly couldn't tell it from that statement....

If Rick had run the kind of campaign that Long Run and I suggested he run, (rather than the wander off into the social issues weeds campaign that he ran) he probably would have won the nomination and be much better positioned to win the election than Romney is....

So I guess he wasn't real smart...

As far the election is concerned the vice presidential nominee is irrelevant. No one cares about the vice president unless the president dies.

[Scooter]

Um, Rick Santorum was seeking the nomination to be the Republican candidate for president. No one runs in the primaries saying they are looking to become vice-president.

[Gob]

Everyone who has an earned income in the UK pays income tax.

Since the UK has a Personal Allowance, a [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_tax_credit]Working Tax Credit, and a Child Tax Credit, that cannot be. I suspect there are other deductions that will further reduce the amount of tax payable.

While they may reduce the tax payable, no one in the UK, who earns a wage, pays no income tax.

You missed the next line

"Despite their name, tax credits are not linked to a person's tax bill."

[Scooter]

If a person earns less than the personal allowance, and less than the amount of income that would be required to generate taxes equal to the amount of the working tax credit and the child tax credit, then he/she is effectively paying no tax. Even if you claim that the fact that working tax credit and the child tax credit are not linked to a person's tax bill means that those should not be considered as reducing income tax, the personal allowance clearly is linked to the tax bill, and that means that in the current tax year someone can earn £8,105 without paying income tax. It clearly says so:

A person who receives less than his/her personal allowance in taxable income (such as earnings and some benefits) in a given tax year does not pay income tax; otherwise, tax must be paid according to how much is earned above this level. Certain residents are entitled to a larger personal allowance than others. Such groups include the over 65s (followed by an increased allowance for over 75s), blind people, and married couples where at least one person in the marriage (or civil partnership) was born before 6 April 1935.

[Gob]

Ok, so, and, yes, what?

A minority, a very very small minority, may not pay any income tax;

in the current tax year someone can earn £8,105 without paying income tax.

To put the pay in an annual perspective, an adult over the age of 22 working at the minimum wage for 7.5 hours a day, 5 days a week, will make £942.50/month and £11,310/year Gross Income. After PAYE this becomes £810.63/month or £9,727.55/year (2009/2010)

Now then, to get back to my point, the US tax system not over complex compared to that of other nations?

[Scooter]

I don't know that it is or isn't. Most of the complexity in a tax code comes from the rules for dealing with business, property and investment income, and from provisions that use the tax code to achieve various public policy objectives. Taxation of income from employment is relatively simple by comparison.

[Gob]

Yep, fair, play, I agree.

[rubato]

"...

Now it may be an anti Obama message, but I heard that Obama took the work part out of Clintons "work"-fare program. If that is so, maybe it's Obama making people dependant.
... "

That was a lie which has been exposed a long time ago. You don't follow these things very closely:


_______________________________
http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/Rober ... aw-dispute

Mitt Romney vs fact-checkers: the welfare law dispute

Mitt Romney's campaign continues to claim that Obama removed the work requirement from the welfare law, despite refutations from fact-checkers and respected newspapers.

By Robert Reich, Guest blogger / August 29, 2012

In this Aug. 25 photo, Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney speaks as vice presidential running mate Rep. Paul Ryan, R-Wis., listens during a campaign rally in Powell, Ohio. According to Reich, Romney's campaign continues to claim that President Obama removed the work requirement from welfare, even though a dozen fact-checking organizations and websites say it isn't true.

“We’re not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers,” says Neil Newhouse, a Romney pollster.
Robert Reich


A half dozen fact-checking organizations and websites have refuted Romney’s claims that Obama removed the work requirement from the welfare law and will cut Medicare benefits by $216 billion.


Last Sunday’s New York Times even reported on its front page that Romney has been “falsely charging” President Obama with removing the work requirement. Those are strong words from the venerable Times. Yet Romney is still making the false charge. Ads containing it continue to be aired.

... "

----------------------------------

Obama did NOT remove the work requirement he strengthened it. And Romney is a proven liar.


yrs,
rubato

[Gob]