The secretly filmed video in which Mitt Romney appeared to disparage the 47% of Americans who do not pay income tax, was nothing compared to the harsh, divisive language used by some US politicians, radio hosts and bloggers.
How did US politics become so polarised?
It was day one of our new life in America. I had arrived to take up my BBC reporting job and my wife and I were bringing our bags from the car. Our new neighbours showed up with cakes and soda. And a warning: "You'll want to re-park your car."
Eh? We had parked outside our picket-fenced new home and thought no more about it. But we had parked facing the opposite direction of traffic. This, in the capital city of the land of the free, is a violation. In Washington, you must park facing the same way as the cars are heading. It is safer, they reason, because you don't have cars nosing out into oncoming stream of vehicles. And my freedom? Fuggedaboutit.
America, a nation we associate with rugged individualism, is actually - at least in its suburban guise - a nation of rules and conformity, a nation of community spirit, enforced where necessary by law. You may not say and do what you like in America, whatever the constitution says. You are expected to play nice. And you are all - every American - "in this together".
So what on earth has gone wrong? Why did Mitt Romney tell those wealthy donors, in the secretly filmed interaction that leaked out this week, that nearly half the nation were of little interest to him?
Never mind the poor politics - how can that be American? It feels so utterly wrong. But Mr Romney was being pretty mild when you look at the totality of the hatred - and that is not too strong a word - that the political classes in modern America throw at each other.
A miserable example comes on my car radio. We are somewhere in the middle of Florida, driving through a tropical rainstorm and a voice is booming out telling me that his opponent in their local congressional race "has benefited personally" from the bank bailout scheme set up in the wake of the financial crisis, "and so has his family!" Basically he's accusing his opponent of being a thief.
And this bile matters. It has real consequences. It leads, in Congress, to deadlock. A nation beset with urgent issues to confront - of which the size of the national debt is probably the most serious - cannot find the cross-party consensus necessary to act.
So here is the big question - a bigger question, frankly, than who is going to win this presidential election... What went wrong? And how can it be fixed?
I have been hearing three theories from Americans from across the political spectrum.
At the end of that rain-soaked journey, I landed at the coastal home of the Florida-based writer and newspaper columnist Carl Hiaasen. He made an interesting point about the sheer number of sources of information on offer to the average American in the digital age. The TV of course, and the radio, but also from the net the blogs and the YouTube video and the snippets of half noticed opinion on Twitter and Facebook. A maelstrom of fact and opinion and sheer nonsense. All mixed up.
Hiaasen feels for his fellow citizens.
"The ability to twist and fabricate makes it so much more difficult to sort through what's true and not true. You need to dig twice as hard."
In these circumstances, no wonder many people defend themselves with the obvious human psychological defence mechanism - they believe what backs up what they already think and disregard the rest!
And more than that, they get angry that with all this so-called information that seems to them to back up their own views, how annoying is it that other folks do not see things the same way? The crush of "facts" actually reduces people's ability to see the other point of view.
Michael Slote, Professor of Ethics at the University of Miami, agrees. But he wonders as well if there is not a deeper issue - an issue that goes to the heart of what it really means to be an American.
He sees that community spirit I identified at the start of this piece as a diminishing quality of American-ness. In fact, he believes it was a recent aberration. The real America is a tougher place, a place where bullying politics is part of the scenery.
He is depressed by what he sees as a nation reverting to type after a period of gentleness - brought on originally by the Depression and the New Deal politics that came after it - which suggested to Americans that in good economic times they could afford to help each other out.
"There is less to go around now. Less room for compromise," he says. "But the hatreds are ideological as well. Some Americans don't see us as having basic obligations to our fellow citizens."
I hope they sort it out. When you talk to individuals here you meet so many who are public-spirited.
The conservative talk show host Joyce Kaufman - who has been in trouble before for incendiary comments about immigration and guns - claims, I think with real justification, to be a backer of all Americans at heart. Even if it went socialist? "Yep," she says. "I don't have to stay if I don't like it here."
And she has a sense of humour. As we were leaving after interviewing her she takes me to one side; "I want to be banned from Britain, then I will feel I have arrived!"
Now that is proper American talk.
Whatever became of America?
Whatever became of America?
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”
Re: Whatever became of America?
Astonishing how civilized we Americans are.We had parked outside our picket-fenced new home and thought no more about it. But we had parked facing the opposite direction of traffic. This, in the capital city of the land of the free, is a violation.
Anyway, it beats all hell out of a place where one can be punished dozens of times for having violated a parking regulation only one time.
Reason is valuable only when it performs against the wordless physical background of the universe.
Re: Whatever became of America?
Like New York City?Andrew D wrote: Anyway, it beats all hell out of a place where one can be punished dozens of times for having violated a parking regulation only one time.
Yeah. You wouldn't want to live there.Two parking tickets for single violation within one hour
What is the name of your state? New York
I parked in NYC approximately 50 yards from the sign which reads “NO STANDING EXCEPT SUNDAYS NO PARKING ANYTIME”. After coming back about 1.5 hr later I found two tickets next to each other. I examined both carefully and found them identical except complainant signature and time: first one was 1:46 PM, second one 2:45 PM. “Violation” section on both states “No Parking (d)”, amount is $65, the same “place of occurrence” and everything else was the same.
Section “Time 1st Observed” is blank on both tickets.
I realize that I misread the sign – “Except Sundays” applied only to “No standing” part, not to “No Parking”. But can I be ticketed twice for the same offence in the same place within 59 minutes?
http://forum.freeadvice.com/parking-tic ... 90537.html
Bah!
Re: Whatever became of America?
Has it been misplaced?
Your collective inability to acknowledge this obvious truth makes you all look like fools.
yrs,
rubato
Re: Whatever became of America?
It is the second level down from Hades now, I believe.
Edited to add: It is also an offence in Aus to park facing the wrong direction of traffic on a road, though it is usually never enforced in the 'burbs.
Edited to add: It is also an offence in Aus to park facing the wrong direction of traffic on a road, though it is usually never enforced in the 'burbs.
Bah!
Re: Whatever became of America?
another of Andrew's strawmen posts, another sad attempt to twist a thread, and avoid the real debate? tch!
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”
Re: Whatever became of America?
Has the second citation beren upheld by a New York court?
Or is it just something that some undereducated meter maid wrote?
Anyway, the issues are not the same. The citations to which I referred were citations for parking in a particular place for more than a stated amount of time. Any competent reader of the English language can grasp that if the stated amount of time is 2 hours, then parking in that particular place for 4 hours is parking there for more than 2 hours exactly once. And parking there for 4000 hours is also parking there for more than 2 hours exactly once.
But by now, no one expexts Gob to be able to see when issues are the same and when they are different.
Or is it just something that some undereducated meter maid wrote?
So both citations are prima facie invalid regardless of the multiple-citations-for-a-single-offense problem.Section “Time 1st Observed” is blank on both tickets.
Anyway, the issues are not the same. The citations to which I referred were citations for parking in a particular place for more than a stated amount of time. Any competent reader of the English language can grasp that if the stated amount of time is 2 hours, then parking in that particular place for 4 hours is parking there for more than 2 hours exactly once. And parking there for 4000 hours is also parking there for more than 2 hours exactly once.
But by now, no one expexts Gob to be able to see when issues are the same and when they are different.
Reason is valuable only when it performs against the wordless physical background of the universe.
Re: Whatever became of America?
As Sue U has just recently and so convincingly demonstrated, Gob you do not even know what a strawman is.Gob wrote:another of Andrew's strawmen posts ....
Reason is valuable only when it performs against the wordless physical background of the universe.
Re: Whatever became of America?
Hoy shit Gob, I know I asked you to practice your logical reasoning, but have the decency to do it in private eh?
Reason is valuable only when it performs against the wordless physical background of the universe.
Re: Whatever became of America?
What is you issue Andrew?
Do you miss drama not being prevalent on this Board?
Do you miss drama not being prevalent on this Board?
Bah!
Re: Whatever became of America?
Any how, back to the OP
This ...
Perhaps it is time for a philosophy of " a fair go for all" for a change?
This ...
And this ..."There is less to go around now. Less room for compromise," he says. "But the hatreds are ideological as well. Some Americans don't see us as having basic obligations to our fellow citizens."
Seem to be at odds with one another. I realise that the first statement only applies to "some" Americans and not all. Though I would be interested to find out the percentage of "some" that felt that way.You are expected to play nice. And you are all - every American - "in this together".
Perhaps it is time for a philosophy of " a fair go for all" for a change?
Bah!
Re: Whatever became of America?
I've said before, I've always found that Americans are intensely, and endearingly, patriotic, what with the whole "flag in the classroom and oath of alliance" stuff. But it seems that there are two or more Americas that people are patriotic to, and they seem to hate the other America more than they hate the Ruskies or Chinese..
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”
Re: Whatever became of America?
That would be "Pledge of Allegiance"....oath of alliance
That's one down on your citizenship exam....
Divisiveness in American politics, if you look at it from an historical perspective, tends to be cyclical; I'm sure that sooner or later we'll get past this....(though things have been pretty bad now for about 20 years through three Administrations; but there are still some things the vast majority of Americans do come together about....
I think the problems have been exacerbated by the advent of the internet and POV cable news channels....
It's become possible now to a greater extent than it was in the past, to avoid ever hearing or reading any views that are contrary or challenging to your own (on the right or the left) if one chooses to do so, and thus to wind up with a very skewed world view, which contributes to the "us versus them" mentality....
Re: Whatever became of America?
Lord Jim wrote: It's become possible now to a greater extent than it was in the past, to avoid ever hearing or reading any views that are contrary or challenging to your own (on the right or the left) if one chooses to do so, and thus to wind up with a very skewed world view, which contributes to the "us versus them" mentality....
Nicely put Jim, although I would qualify it with; It's become possible now to a greater extent than it was in the past, to avoid ever hearing or reading any views that are contrary or challenging to your own (on the right or the left) if one chooses to do so, or if you do hear so, then rest assured you will be able to find suitable pundits who will tell you that "up is down, black is white, and I promise I won't come in your mouth," in order to take away the threat of thinking."
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”
Re: Whatever became of America?
Unfortunately, there are a lot of people out there who are more interested in getting validation of what they already believe rather than getting information in order to intelligently construct their views....
These people don't want to think....
And you're right, there's a huge cadre of people out there, across the political spectrum, who are more than happy spout back to folks whatever validating crap they want to hear; on the radio, on the tube, on blogs and websites, in books....there's big bucks to be made in that, so there's no shortage of "validators"....
These people don't want to think....
And you're right, there's a huge cadre of people out there, across the political spectrum, who are more than happy spout back to folks whatever validating crap they want to hear; on the radio, on the tube, on blogs and websites, in books....there's big bucks to be made in that, so there's no shortage of "validators"....
Re: Whatever became of America?
Agreed. It's also happening here and in the UK, but too, (I think) a far lesser degree.
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”
Re: Whatever became of America?
Personally, I would get bored to death only listening to or reading opinions that agreed with my own, so I've never really understood this attitude....
It must stem essentially from a complete lack of intellectual curiosity, (and probably also a lack of self confidence)
I find that by exposing and testing my ideas to different perspectives, I can hone and refine my opinions and positions in ways I otherwise wouldn't...personally I find this to be a very stimulating and satisfying process....
It must stem essentially from a complete lack of intellectual curiosity, (and probably also a lack of self confidence)
I find that by exposing and testing my ideas to different perspectives, I can hone and refine my opinions and positions in ways I otherwise wouldn't...personally I find this to be a very stimulating and satisfying process....
Re: Whatever became of America?
Agreed, though the contrary opinion should always be of a higher quality than...
not that finding higher quality comment than that is hard, outside of the locked wards that is...rubato wrote:Fuck you.
People who care about facts and real analysis will care about those things no matter what.
People who don't care (like nearly all republicans) will never care and you can't make them.
LJ and DGS will never care about facts in this universe or any other. Ever. In all the course of human history.
I have proven that conservative states predict the highest rates of teen pregnancy for all racial groups individually. And Liberal states predict the lowest rates for all racial groups individually.
But they do not care. They want their daughters to be knocked up so they can blame them for being sluts and whores.
yrs,
rubato
“If you trust in yourself, and believe in your dreams, and follow your star. . . you'll still get beaten by people who spent their time working hard and learning things and weren't so lazy.”
Re: Whatever became of America?
Yes, it's almost impossible not to come up with something of better quality than that... 
(Geez, just reading that again makes me feel like taking a long hot shower...)
You take the bad with the good...
There are a lot of bright, knowledgeable, articulate folks here who come from perspectives different than mine that I enjoy testing my ideas with....
Rube is more on the order of comic relief.....
Though as I said before, he serves some other purposes here too....
One thing I frequently get from him, (Like when I read a post like that) is a real sense of gratitude....
Whatever challenges I may have in life, at least I can be grateful that I'm not going through life as the sort vile, toxic, small minded and miserable creature that could produce something like that....
There is no amount of money that I could be paid to be willing to go through life as rube....
It really must be awful to be him; that's only way to explain the extraordinary level of toxicity and misanthropy....
People who are happy and satisfied with their lives do not produce that quantity of bile....
We can all be grateful that we're not rube....
(Geez, just reading that again makes me feel like taking a long hot shower...)
You take the bad with the good...
There are a lot of bright, knowledgeable, articulate folks here who come from perspectives different than mine that I enjoy testing my ideas with....
Rube is more on the order of comic relief.....
Though as I said before, he serves some other purposes here too....
One thing I frequently get from him, (Like when I read a post like that) is a real sense of gratitude....
Whatever challenges I may have in life, at least I can be grateful that I'm not going through life as the sort vile, toxic, small minded and miserable creature that could produce something like that....
There is no amount of money that I could be paid to be willing to go through life as rube....
It really must be awful to be him; that's only way to explain the extraordinary level of toxicity and misanthropy....
People who are happy and satisfied with their lives do not produce that quantity of bile....
We can all be grateful that we're not rube....
Re: Whatever became of America?
And when you have nothing coherent to say and it is too much effort to engage in reason turn the thread into a hate-fest.
You'll always have company there.
yrs,
rubato
You'll always have company there.
yrs,
rubato