UK out of Europe now!!

[Gob]

Fuck me pink....

They are the backbone of church fetes, village fairs and jumble sales all around the country.

But the thousands who regularly sell their home-made jam, marmalade or chutney in re-used jars may have to abandon their traditions after a warning that they are breaching European health and safety regulations. Legal advisers to Britain’s Churches have sent out a circular saying that while people can use jars for jam at home or to give to family and friends, they cannot sell them or even give them away as raffle prizes at a public event.


The circular from the Churches’ Legislation Advisory Service, which is chaired by the Bishop of Exeter, is pointedly headed: ‘Please take note: this looks like a spoof but it’s not.’ The advisers say the rules that are being breached are the snappily-titled EC Regulations 1935/2004 and 2023/2006, which prevent containers being re-used unless they are specifically designed for that purpose.

The Women’s Institute said it was offering similar advice on the re-use of jam jars to its 210,000 members. A spokesman said the news could send ‘a tremor through middle-England’ and the organisation was braced for a flurry of inquiries. The Food Standards Agency said the rules had been introduced because there was a risk of chemicals leaching out of old containers and contaminating food, though it added that it was not aware that re-used jam jars were a safety hazard.

The agency said it was up to local authority environmental health officers to enforce the regulations, and penalties can reach a maximum of a £5,000 fine, six months’ imprisonment, or both [but you get a £50 fine, six days’ imprisonment for murder in the UK?]. The news will alarm the growing number of jam-makers inspired by model Kate Moss, who makes damson jam out of fruit from her Cotswolds estate, and the Duchess of Cambridge, who keeps pots to give away to friends.

Mary Berry, the star of the BBC’s The Great British Bake Off, said: ‘This is absolutely stupid. It is just going too far. ‘We are encouraging people to save money by using fruits to make chutneys and jam, and if they have to buy new jars it will become much too expensive. It’s daft.’ The rules are also causing consternation in churches that rely on the hundreds of thousands of pounds raised from fetes and bazaars.
The Rev Derek Williams, a spokesman for the diocese of Peterborough, said enforcing the rule ‘would be a blow to fundraising events for all sorts of voluntary organisations’.

He added: ‘It’s quite ridiculous, as selling home-made jams and chutneys has always been a traditional and important part of fundraising for church groups and others. ‘Older people in particular, or those not terribly well-off, have never been shy of making a few pots and giving that away. ‘People will offer their home-made jam when perhaps they can’t give anything else.’

Mr Williams said he had never heard of anyone falling ill from eating jam from a re-used jar, adding: ‘There must be a sensible balance between health and safety and something that has happened without incident for centuries.’ Canon Michael Tristran, of Portsmouth Cathedral, said: ‘On realising this was not a belated April Fool’s joke, I was very anxious, not only from the fundraising point of view for all our churches, but also because it goes against the green agenda of recycling.’

The WI said anyone using old jars should sterilise them by washing them and drying them in an oven on a low heat.

[The Hen]

You aren't meant to reuse egg cartons here as the contents will vary from the label.

[oldr_n_wsr]

The only reuse I've seen from egg cartons was for arts-n-crafts.

[Crackpot]

I've seen them hold eggs!

[Sean]

They're pretty good for soundproofing a room too...

[Sue U]

They're pretty good for soundproofing a room too...

Your amp must really suck.

[MajGenl.Meade]

I'm sure the Eurocrats have reams of statistics detailing the gruesome deaths of thousands, nay millions of people who've bought home-made jam. Honey. Marmalade. Preserved fruit. Pancakes. Sausage. And they thought WMDs were in Iraq! Idiots!

Meade

PS Sue that's why he needs the soundproofing; cries of ecstasy upset the neighbours

[Sean]

They're pretty good for soundproofing a room too...

Your amp must really suck.

To follow on from Meade... What amp?

[alice]

You aren't meant to reuse egg cartons here as the contents will vary from the label.

The only reuse I've seen from egg cartons was for arts-n-crafts.

I've seen them hold eggs!

Anyone who had chooks or ducks and too many eggs used to welcome old egg cartons. They'd reuse them for packaging their own eggs for sale or giveaway. I imagine that would be meant by The Hen's (how appropriate for this comment ... giggle giggle ) comment, because home grown chook or duck eggs would be all varied sizes etc and not from the same source as the carton label would suggest.

[dgs49]

Please clarify. When folks in my family "can" fruits and vegetables they use what we refer to as "canning jars." these are glass jars with brass two-piece lids. The lids include a red rubber seal that makes a water and air-tight seal when you close them. Typically, you put the "goods" in the jars while hot, close them, then allow them to cool. This creates a partial vacuum that seals the jar more or less permanently.

Is this what is being banned by the EU?

It seems to me that these canning jars are made for re-use, and therefore ought to be OK.

What am I missing?

[Scooter]

Probably nothing. It is another one of those articles slamming health and safety regulations that is poorly written and does its best to obfuscate precisely what is being prohibited by the regulations and why.

[oldr_n_wsr]

My grandmother had those "double type brass lid" jars along with mason jars, those onse where the lid was on some wire push down thingie and a bunch of extra rubber seal rings she would change each time she sealed new stuff in the jars.
All jars were cleaned and boiled prior to re-use.

Up until I was around 12 years old I didn't know you could buy jelly/jam in a supermarket, we always got it homemade from grandma. Same with jarred peaches and apples and strawberries and blueberries, etc.
I miss my grandma and Tante Anna (who also jarred fruits and veggies).

[Sean]

Probably nothing. It is another one of those articles slamming health and safety regulations that is poorly written and does its best to obfuscate precisely what is being prohibited by the regulations and why.

In fact the EC regulations mentioned in the article (1935/2004 and 2023/2006) are solely about the manufacture of food packaging and have nothing whatsoever to do with the re-use of packaging as claimed by the article.

[Andrew D]

Isn't there a similar thread somewhere involving kids' lemonade stands?

[MajGenl.Meade]

Well I've read both the regulations and disagree. Yes, they do contemplate the governance of food product handling and manufacturing in the larger sense - they are not aimed at mom and pop at the church fete. However, a major emphasis is on any food product/handling that is offered for sale and it is not restricted to "folks who sell more than X euros worth".

"The article" is not really the issue - the writer didn't make it up. What we have here is a group making a rod for their own backs. The Churches Legislation Advisory Service are the culprits IMO. Here we have a group of zealous legal beagles poring over minute regulations and extrapolating the unobvious - "the Euro police are going to bust Mrs. Miggins for providing plum jam at the village fete!". So they issue a stern warning that using jamjars over and over might result in the death penalty

Now they've brought everyone's attention to a (non) problem; declared it a problem; caused a huge fuss and outrage. When all they had to do was keep their durned mouths shut and grandma would happily be raising funds for the WI by selling little pots of home-made jams and jellies while the vicar beams on in the sunshine.

Meade

[rubato]

Glass is chosen as a container material because it is re-usable. Hence it is not forbidden under the statute.


The circular from the Churches’ Legislation Advisory Service, which is chaired by the Bishop of Exeter, is pointedly headed: ‘Please take note: this looks like a spoof but it’s not.’ The advisers say the rules that are being breached are the snappily-titled EC Regulations 1935/2004 and 2023/2006, which prevent containers being re-used unless they are specifically designed for that purpose . "

yrs,
rubato

[MajGenl.Meade]

Yes rubato but it does contemplate glass because (for example) Robertson's Marmalade jars are NOT intended by the company for re-use. You homemade jam person just fills 'em up and pops the lid back on after removing the label and adding one of their own usually. You will find glass listed as among the affected items.

The regulations cover not only containers but also everything that comes into contact with food - or may come into contact and also regulates the labelling and ink. But again, it is primarily aimed at larger scale production and at degradable containers (by which I mean ones that chemically breakdown in some way or anohter - like my reusing my plastic water bottles).

Meade